Hi Phil:

Thanks for the feedback. No I don't believe that
Gopi came from a Christic perspective. In fact with
further consideration I believed he understood Christianity through Hindu eyes. Like how I view
other religions through Christian eyes.

On another note, I see now that the kundalini process, for me, was placed under the direction of the Holy Spirit early on. Within 2 weeks of my being
aware that something was happening. So I have not experienced what some have experienced who went to the East & then came to Christianity. I am unable to personally relate to their experience & struggle to come to Christ . But then I don't believe that they can relate to my experience either.

For me, when kundalini is criticized & considered evil, something to be feared & what not I hear God being criticized as I believe kundalini is a creation of God. I don't believe it is God, nor the Holy Spirit but a creation of God. Perhaps this is where there may be some misunderstandings about kundalini either on my part or others part.

I can see where I have made mistakes in my journey with God. Where I didn't hold fast to only Jesus and am learning from these mistakes. Going to the East for answers was not the answer for me.

quote:

Originally posted by Phil:
Good post above, Tucker. Thanks.

And good to see you here again, Mary Sue. I don't think Gopi Krishna had the Christic perspective Tucker shared above. Without Christ, dealing with K could be like riding a wild bull, even when one lives a moral and balanced life.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Mary Sue,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandit_Gopi_Krishna

This website talks about Pandit Gopi Krishna:

http://www.answers.com/topic/gopi-krishna

Quote from above website: "During his lifetime he made great efforts to interest scientists in investigating and verifying the phenomenon of kundalini as a biological force in human affairs, with implications for the study of the paranormal as well as the intellectual and ethical evolution of humanity."

Pandit Gopi maintained that the kundalini was a biological force. I agree 100% with that statement. He also said that proper control and use of the kundalini leads to all sorts of wondrous things. I also agree with that. One of the wondrous things was a higher state of consciousness, I also agree with that.

It has been brought to my attention that if one does not involve the sex chakra when one is moving energy up and down the center of the spinal column (tip of the tail bone to the center of the brain up and down the center of the spinal column) then one is doing spinal breathing. If one adds the energy of the sex chakra to the spinal breathing exercise, they are then raising the kundlini. And this sex energy can be raised up the center of the spine, in front of the spine, up the center of the body (center pillar), and up the outside of the front of the body (front energy kundalini). Different systems raise the kundalini in different places. If one is female side of the brain dominant, then they will raise the kundilini as female; if one is male side of the brain dominant, then they will raise the kundalini as male; and if the two sides of one's brain is in a state of balance, then they will raise the balanced kundalini.

My only objection is equating the kundalini with the Holy Spirit, they are not the same thing.

And if the power of the kundalini is used for evil, then it is evil. If the power of the kundalini is used for good, then it is good. I do not feel that the kundalini is evil, I feel that the kundalini is dangerous if fully understood and in the wrong hands. Luckly what is understood in today's world about the kundalini is very incomplete knowledge and only a threat to those that attempt to explore it without proper guidance from a true kundalini master, which are very rare in today's world.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Tucker,

And while I am on this subject, if one wishes to explore and manipulate the spirit side of creation, then one takes the balanced kundalini out through the pineal gland into the areas above the head; if one wishes to explore and manipulate the physical side of creation, then one takes the balanced kundalini out through the pituitary gland into the area in front of the upper part of the forehead and from there up toward Heaven at a 45 degree angle. If one wishes to explore and manipulate both the spirit side of creation and the physical side of creation at the same time (stereo), then the balanced kundalini is held in both places at the same time. Ideally if one wanted to do stereo, they would bring the balanced kundalini up the center of their body thus automatically creating a balanced foundation for the stereo exploration and manipulation of the two sides of creation. You do not need God to be a god.

[Hi Tucker:
I am trying to relate to what you are saying about kundalini but I am having difficulty with it. What I am calling kundalini is not something the mind can control, direct and mold to it's will. Perhaps I would know it as prana or psychic energy I don't know???


.QUOTE]Originally posted by Tucker:
And while I am on this subject, if one wishes to explore and manipulate the spirit side of creation, then one takes the balanced kundalini out through the pineal gland into the areas above the head; if one wishes to explore and manipulate the physical side of creation, then one takes the balanced kundalini out through the pituitary gland into the area in front of the upper part of the forehead and from there up toward Heaven at a 45 degree angle. ....[/QUOTE]

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Mary Sue,

quote:

Originally posted by Phil:
...... Without Christ, dealing with K could be like riding a wild bull, even when one lives a moral and balanced life.

Gopi wrote about his experience. I had forgotten how difficult it had been.
http://kundalini.se/eng/kundalini_krishna.html

quote:

Originally posted by BlissInTheHeart:
Tucker,
just interested:

How does the concept of macrocosmos (the physicle cosmos) and the microcosmos (the spiritual inner cosmos inside each individual)
fit together with your concept of "spirtual side and physical side of the creation" ? Is, what you call "spiritual side", s this the microcosmos?

Bliss the challenge to explaining things is always language "macro" means large and "micro" means small. When God caused His spirit to move over the deep He created movement on the surface of an ocean of "micro" in a state of non movement. He then separated the moving "micro" from the non moving "micro" and the Bible says that He called this moving "micro" light and the non moving "micro" dark. He now had a field of moving/vibrating "micro". He then dried up the lower half of this field of moving "micro" to create matter, the "macro". The "macro" could be called, very dense "micro". The physical reality is made up of the "macro" (dried up "micro") and the spirit reality is made up of the "micro", and both are in a state of vibrational movement with the "macro" (dried up "micro") also being in a state of linear movement.

Now as an attempt to put things simply, we basically are made up of three things, the mind, the spirit (micro" in movement), and the physical (the "macro" [dried up "micro"] in movement). What I am calling spirit is the "micro" side of things and what I am calling physical is the "macro" side of things with the understanding that the ("micro") spirit is both inside of the physical and outside of the physical.

The word spiritual refers to the realities that are created out of the "micro" in movement and the word physical refers to the realities that are created out of the "macro" (dried up micro) in movement. The female side of our brain is a lens that is designed to observe and manipulate the realities that are created out of the "micro" and the male side of our brain is a lens that is designed to observe and manipulate the realities that are created out of the "macro". The "micro is one side of creation and the "macro" is the other side of creation. Now when one is looking out through both lenses at the same time they are then observing creation in "stereo". They are observing both the realities created out of the "micro" and the realities created out of the "macro" at the same time. People that are inclined toward the female side of the brain see things as "energy"; people that are inclined toward the male side of the brain see things as "mass". The physical is a world made up/out of "mass" (the macro); and the spiritual is a world made up/out of "energy" (the micro).

So anyway Bliss, the above was what I was attempting to say and thank you for your question!

quote:

Originally posted by Mary Sue:
[Hi Tucker:
I am trying to relate to what you are saying about kundalini but I am having difficulty with it. What I am calling kundalini is not something the mind can control, direct and mold to it's will. Perhaps I would know it as prana or psychic energy I don't know???


.QUOTE]Originally posted by Tucker:
And while I am on this subject, if one wishes to explore and manipulate the spirit side of creation, then one takes the balanced kundalini out through the pineal gland into the areas above the head; if one wishes to explore and manipulate the physical side of creation, then one takes the balanced kundalini out through the pituitary gland into the area in front of the upper part of the forehead and from there up toward Heaven at a 45 degree angle. ....

[/QUOTE]

A properly trained mind can mold anything but another properly trained mind to it's will (with the understanding that there is always 2% creativity in creation and nobody knows when and how that is going to just pop up). The kundalini is energy that is generated by the sex chakra energy center. This energy can be controlled if one's mind is properly trained. The heart chakra also can generate an energy which can also be controlled if one's mind is properly trained. And when the energy that is generated by the heart charkra is combined with the presence of God under the sacrifice and salvation of Jesus our Christ, one enters into the family of God.

Psychic energy causes prana to become whatever you want it to become. Psychic energy can be sex chakra energy in use (kundalini) or it can be heart chakra energy in use (Love). One should be aware of the fact though that if one uses the heart chakra as an energy source combined with the presence of God under the sacrifice of Jesus, to lead others away from Jesus and God, that they will have committed a sin against the Holy Spirit.

Thank you Tucker for further clarification. I understand a little better what you have been through to come to Jesus's calling. This does not sound like it has been an easy road.

In case you are interested I found this an
informative website for some of the Christian
practices I was/have been drawn to. I was not
aware of kundalini within me until 2 weeks before I experienced my first ecstatic union with God.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C...quired_contemplation

quote:

Originally posted by Tucker:

A properly trained mind can mold anything but another properly trained mind to it's will (with the understanding that there is always 2% creativity in creation and nobody knows when and how that is going to just pop up). The kundalini is energy that is generated by the sex chakra energy center. This energy can be controlled if one's mind is properly trained. The heart chakra also can generate an energy which can also be controlled if one's mind is properly trained. And when the energy that is generated by the heart charkra is combined with the presence of God under the sacrifice and salvation of Jesus our Christ, one enters into the family of God.

Psychic energy causes prana to become whatever you want it to become. Psychic energy can be sex chakra energy in use (kundalini) or it can be heart chakra energy in use (Love). One should be aware of the fact though that if one uses the heart chakra as an energy source combined with the presence of God under the sacrifice of Jesus, to lead others away from Jesus and God, that they will have committed a sin against the Holy Spirit.[/QUOTE]

quote:

Originally posted by Mary Sue:
Thank you Tucker for further clarification. I understand a little better what you have been through to come to Jesus's calling. This does not sound like it has been an easy road.

In case you are interested I found this an
informative website for some of the Christian
practices I was/have been drawn to. I was not
aware of kundalini within me until 2 weeks before I experienced my first ecstatic union with God.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C...quired_contemplation

quote:

Originally posted by Tucker:

A properly trained mind can mold anything but another properly trained mind to it's will (with the understanding that there is always 2% creativity in creation and nobody knows when and how that is going to just pop up). The kundalini is energy that is generated by the sex chakra energy center. This energy can be controlled if one's mind is properly trained. The heart chakra also can generate an energy which can also be controlled if one's mind is properly trained. And when the energy that is generated by the heart charkra is combined with the presence of God under the sacrifice and salvation of Jesus our Christ, one enters into the family of God.

Psychic energy causes prana to become whatever you want it to become. Psychic energy can be sex chakra energy in use (kundalini) or it can be heart chakra energy in use (Love). One should be aware of the fact though that if one uses the heart chakra as an energy source combined with the presence of God under the sacrifice of Jesus, to lead others away from Jesus and God, that they will have committed a sin against the Holy Spirit.

[/QUOTE]

Mary, I had my first mystic experience when I was five years old (my first prayer to God in the name of Jesus Christ) and have absolutely loved God and Jesus ever since. Been fifty-seven years now.

QUOTE] Mary, I had my first mystic experience when I was five years old (my first prayer to God in the name of Jesus Christ) and have absolutely loved God and Jesus ever since. Been fifty-seven years now.[/QUOTE]


Tucker,
Do you consider yourself a Christian & follow Christian practices. Or do you consider yourself a yogi who loves God & Jesus & follows non Christian practices? Or some combination of such.

Thanks

quote:

Originally posted by Mary Sue:
QUOTE] Mary, I had my first mystic experience when I was five years old (my first prayer to God in the name of Jesus Christ) and have absolutely loved God and Jesus ever since. Been fifty-seven years now.

Tucker,
Do you consider yourself a Christian & follow Christian practices. Or do you consider yourself a yogi who loves God & Jesus & follows non Christian practices? Or some combination of such. Thanks.[/QUOTE]

That is a very good question Mary Sue. And I often wonder about that myself.

Humm?

Lets start here: Most Christians would not consider me a Christian and most yogis would not consider me a yogi. If I was judged be their criteria, then I would not be considered a Christian or a yogi. Both would consider me a demon. And sometimes I wonder about that myself. Technically I am exploring the world of Christianity and the world of yogi both at the same time under the guidance of Father God and Jesus as a mystic and I have been a mystic since my first prayer to Father God in the name of Jesus Christ when I was five years old.

Now, both traditional yoga and traditional Christianity consider being a mystic a valid approach to God. The problem is that Christian mystics and yogi mystics are never completely traditional in their approach to traditional Christianity or traditional yoga. Because the goal of traditional Christianity and traditional yoga is to maintain tradition, mystics are considered in a class of their own and for the most part not to be associated with or accepted as valid. Mary Sue, I am a Christian yogi mystic and yes I am not what would be considered traditional (or valid) by either traditional Christianity or traditional yoga. Marry Sue, that is the best that I can do to answer your question. From there I am judged however you wish to judge me based on your personal approach to reality. And whatever you decide is ok.

I've been away this past weekend and it looks like you all have been having fun.

Tucker, you really should write out your story sometime -- sort of like Shasha has done with hers, and even mine in my book on kundalini. It's really interesting to hear you share what you've learned about K process from the yogic perspective, and you confirm many of the intuitions I've had about all this myself. What I do believe is that all these energy processes can be both activated and ordered by the Holy Spirit, which is why so many Christian mystics evidenced incredible powers (healing, miracles, psychic powers, etc.). If one goes after it for the wrong reasons, however, then look out!

Re. what it means to be a Christian, I think your answer makes sense, even considering yourself a
"Christian yogi master." The critical issue is where one stands with respect to Jesus, and from what I've heard you share, it sounds like he is, for you, the One to whom you credit your salvation and life direction. Technically, one is considered a Christian if one is a follower of Christ. There are important doctrines that go along with this, of course, but believing the doctrines doesn't make one a Christian; it is professing Christ as Lord and surrendering one's life to his guidance that is most important.

quote:

Originally posted by Tucker:
...
A properly trained mind can mold anything but another properly trained mind to it's will...

Psychic energy causes prana to become whatever you want it to become. ...

One should be aware of the fact though that if one uses the heart chakra as an energy source combined with the presence of God under the sacrifice of Jesus, to lead others away from Jesus and God, that they will have committed a sin against the Holy Spirit.

About your first two points above, another reason we can

never

equate

kundalini with the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit cannot be manipulated. We cannot 'use' God for evil purposes the way you and I both know kundalini can be used.

About your last point, very interesting intuition, Tucker. That's my concern too. And if you equate kundalini with the Holy Spirit, you are liable to lead people away from Christ. After all, who needs Jesus if you have kundalini flying out of your head and you basically can get all your needs met by energy? Better to feed the poor and pray for the sick, where God is crying out for your love.

quote:

Originally posted by Phil:
I've been away this past weekend and it looks like you all have been having fun.

Tucker, you really should write out your story sometime -- sort of like Shasha has done with hers, and even mine in my book on kundalini. It's really interesting to hear you share what you've learned about K process from the yogic perspective, and you confirm many of the intuitions I've had about all this myself. What I do believe is that all these energy processes can be both activated and ordered by the Holy Spirit, which is why so many Christian mystics evidenced incredible powers (healing, miracles, psychic powers, etc.). If one goes after it for the wrong reasons, however, then look out!

Re. what it means to be a Christian, I think your answer makes sense, even considering yourself a
"Christian yogi master." The critical issue is where one stands with respect to Jesus, and from what I've heard you share, it sounds like he is, for you, the One to whom you credit your salvation and life direction. Technically, one is considered a Christian if one is a follower of Christ. There are important doctrines that go along with this, of course, but believing the doctrines doesn't make one a Christian; it is professing Christ as Lord and surrendering one's life to his guidance that is most important.

Phil I agree with what you said about the Holy Spirit. And based on my experience the Holy Spirit uses the heart chakra as the energy source to do these things with. Both the heart chakra and the sex chakra can be the source of powerful creative energy, it is just that the energy that is generated by the heart chakra is way more powerful. "They will do miracles and you will do greater miracles." But at this time nobody seems to be doing any miracles so I guess that we will just have to wait to see how that goes.

I am a Christian and thank you for saying so Phil and I do agree with your definition.

About writing? Phil, basically everything that I know about stuff I have posted on your message board, so technically everything that I know has already be written by me and published by you . It is ok that I did that isn't it? You are loved!

acaveyogi/sunmystic

quote:

Originally posted by aviela:
Do you feel that there might be some "mystics" that are being guided by the holy spirit that may not be consciously following Christ??? But are nonetheless fulfilling the teachings & lifestyle and thus being guided by the principles??? What about Buddha???

If your question is to me, then my answer is absolutely not. In yoga and Buddhism you have to work off your sins, with Jesus you start out sin free and from there it all depends on whether you are rocky ground, shallow ground, or fertile ground. If you are fertile ground, then you and the Holy Spirit become really good buds and the Holy Spirit does guide you. Folks that are non Christians might be getting good advice from somewhere (that happens to a lot of good people), but it is not from the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is only a gift to Christians. That is the way that Jesus set things up.