Is it Depression, or is it the
Loss of the Affective Ego Leading to Spiritual Gain?

The Arrajs and I have been comparing notes and discussing this topic for years now. With their publication of this web page, we're hoping to discover if others can relate to the experience, and how they understand it.

I can share that, for myself, what they describe fits my own experience to a fraction of a degree. Even after over 15 years, however, I'm still adjusting to this phenomenon and can imagine that some who've come upon this state would consider it a "loss of self," even a psychopathology of some kind. I do not consider it such, but (perhaps) an example of apathaea or profound detachment that the desert fathers thought so valuable. There are many positive consequences which ensue--none the least of which is that one isn't getting pushed around by emotions any more. Also, when I don't over-work (especially mentally), there is a subtle flow of bliss buoying up my heart--the ananda of the Hindus, and the joy which Christ promised. Nevertheless, as I say, it takes some getting used to and can feel like psychic death, in many ways.

Comments? Experiences?

Dude,

You seem pretty healthy to me But what do I know, as Father Keating says, "We're all so damn sick." Fortunately, God delights in using people who are not well yet.

Look at Abraham Lincoln or Winston Churchill. How many failures and depressions did they go through? F.D.R. was humbled with illness. They were prepared to take great nations through some very rough going.

How many people in the bible had all their marbles? Seems like nearly all of them went through the wringer. A very long list of what Oprah would call "dysfunctional" people. God is so generous not to sugar coat it for us. Spiritual life is war and "war is hell.

I can't remember if I found you through Arraj or the other way 'round, but I read through his sight a couple of years ago and would like to do it again. Greatful

I've been watching myself and others go through this school of depression for about nine years now and if it works it's magic, the individual seems to come back stronger and more humble. Not alot of conceit in spiritual groups. I see many more people who echo Merton's prayer,

"I can't see the road on front of me, and don't know where I am going, but trust that the desire to please you, pleases you..."

caritas,

michael

<*))))><

I like to discuss this and related issues out of own experience without delving in philosophical and theological theories.

To begin with I would like to call affective Ego False self. In my understanding the purpose of false self is defending its territory by creating many obstacles to survive. These obstacles can be the usual activity of mind. Because false self knows dismantling its territory means its definitive death. So, false self must defend to survive. I know it is very difficult to understand unless we experience it. Depression is a symptom of damaged false self. Arriving at the edge of depression can be transformative if we learn the art of observing and watching. At this critical moment if we observe the activity of damaged false self without judging it is likely that we can be transformed and come to our True self. Experiencing this process fully is enlightenemnet.

Grace, I follow, but I don't think the false self is necessarily the same thing as what Jim describes as the affective ego. Here's his brief definition:
The affective ego means the ego and the affective energy that normally animates it and sets it in motion in a search for gratification.

This energy and the gratification it seeks need not be in the service of the false self; it can actually be an enthusiasm in the service of compassion, or Christian mission. Compare this understanding with the description of the false self I list on this page.

I do like your point about about the value of observing and watching, especially when one is experiencing a kind of depression. I would not characterize my experience of the loss of the affective ego as akin to depression, however, in that it lacks the "down" or "blue" feeling that comes with depression. Unlike depression, which has a definite affective content, this state seems to be altogether devoid of emotion or feeling until one is engaged in an activity of some kind. Then, the appropriate feeling emerges; once that is over, however, things revert back to zero -- a state of flatness or apathaea. I'm aware that some counselors might consider this dissociation or a type of depression, but I would disagree, and so would the Arrajs -- which is why we're hoping this experience will become better understood.

Hi All,

I've been reading this thread with interest. I actually ran across it by "accident"! Anyway, I've been experiencing myself moving toward this state for about a month now. I work as a chaplain at a trauma center in Dallas and so I have taken up centering prayer as a daily discipline and form of self-care.

I was most struck by several phrases from the article you referenced, Phil. First, I have a noticed a kind of "quiet" that I've experienced frequently in the past several weeks. I've often thought it felt like a "death" of some kind but was never really sure of what?????? It's as if something's just gone....? Secondly, I've noticed a lowered energy level and an ability to rest more. Now, don't get me wrong; I have plenty of energy and pizzazz when I'm working or gardening or cooking or whatever...when there's a task to do. It's just that afterwards, I can go back to "zero" when it's all done.

I've been particularly concerned because I seem to have really begun to experience this "sense" (if you could call it that) after publicly stating my intention to pursue a calling to the diaconate. (I'm Episcopalian) It's not that I feel unsettled so much as I feel just "blah". There's none of the fiery energy I'm used to experiencing when I make decisions or choose a course of action. I was just journaling this morning and wondering what might be going on and then I ran across this thread. I'd never even heard of this "loss of the affective ego" before. I guess I'd better read Arraj's entire article, huh?

Oh, another thing I've noticed is that "stuff" just doesn't bother me the way it used to. Things can be said and I no longer take them as personal as I used to. I don't identify myself with someone's criticism of what I've said or done easily anymore. I can "get over" "slights or insults" better. I'm grateful to God for just this change, 'cause this has always been a big issue for me.
Thanks for letting me share...
F.

Ok, Phil, I read it again, along with the page about the false self. Arraj is so helpful because his specialty is this phase between meditation and contemplation, where people are most likely to be seeking direction and experiencing some disorientation.

I assume we are disregarding organic depression or reactive depression due to health problems. I've got both and seem to require a low dose of an SSRI to deal with it.

I have a half a dozen books on depression and the only one I really read was God's Psychiatry by
a Christian psychiatrist. Guess what it addressed?
Sin. However you get rid of it, you have to do this first. This has been my experience. Hard head, stubborn heart.

After dealing with the above, there is the dismantling of the emotional programs and cultural conditioning. Who am I with out all these ideas I have about myself? Am I the holes in the Swiss cheese? Very disorienting. Despair. Humility. Who wants to be humble, really? The spiritual pride turns out to be just another ego trip and the feeling that now that I am a mystic, I am a special sort of person and different is also an illusion and a phase which will pass in time. These are enormous changes wrought by the Spirit.

whoamI.com <*))))><

Freda, it sounds like you have some of the symptoms of the "disease" all right. It is precisely this re-setting of consciousness back to "zero" that takes some getting used to for, prior to the loss of affectivity as described here, the Ego is usually moved one way or another and senses from these inner movements a kind of direction being suggested for one's life. You might even say that with the loss of the affective Ego, there is a loss of intentional consciousness, which does feel like the loss of interiority and a kind of psychic death. I strongly suspect that this is, in large part, what many in the spiritual literature are referring to as a "loss of self," or "no-self." If this were only a passing phase/dark night between developmental levels, that would be one thing; but when one is "stuck" there for almost 20 years, as some of us have been, might as well say it's not simply transitional.

You describe very well some of the good fruit that comes from this condition and, truth be told, I wouldn't want to go back to the "old ways" at all even if I could. For one thing, I don't even remember what that was like! But since pretty much everyone I relate to has an Affective Ego, I see the difference between what they go through and my usual state. Thanks, but no thanks!

It seems to me that there is something of an "acquired taste" that one must develop to live in this new psychic world, and I think this is where the metaphor of the desert in Christian mystical literature becomes relevant. The desert appears to be arid and lifeless, but upon closer inspection, there are all kinds of living things that have found a way to survive there. One must look and listen deeply to notice them, but they're there! I liken this to the sensitivity one develops to subtle movements in the psyche; they fall below the radar of the Affective Ego, but the dis-affected Ego, in its thirst for a sense of life, learns to listen for them and cherish what is found. Sometimes, it is the "still small voice of the Spirit" that is detected--a tiny rivulet of life meandering along, somewhat obscure, but exuding peace.

Another delightful compensation for me is that with the diminishment of intentionality, the world of the senses has become more awakened. I will save that for another post, however, as this one has already gone on long enough.

Michael, I see we cross-posted. I've got to run now, but will get back to you soon.

Phil, when I wrote the above post I thought false self and affective ego are the same. If they are two different things I need clarity before I comment.

I reread the article of Jim and I don't clearly understand what the difference between affective ego and false self. In one passage he mentioned about what he called empirical ego, "Our egos, or sense of self - taken in a concrete or empirical way and not in a metaphysical sense - are glued together by the acts we make with our natural faculties, and these faculties, in turn, are driven by our desires and the gratification we receive by fulfilling these desires. In other words, what holds the empirical ego together could be called affective energy." I wonder if empirical ego is false self? if the answer is yes and then what is the difference between empirical ego and affective ego?

In my understanding the energy of false self and the energy of True self is not the same. While the energy of false self stems from very limited energy of mind the energy of True self stems from the vast energy of the God which includes the energy of the limited energy. During the process of transformation from false self to True self, it is the energy of limited mind which undergo transformation to become united with the energy of the God. According to Jim it is affective energy which holds the empirical ego together and Phil pointed out "This energy [affective energy] and the gratification it seeks need not be in the service of the false self; it can actually be an enthusiasm in the service of compassion, or Christian mission." Do you mean it is the same energy which holds both the empirical ego and the Ego of the soul?

Thomas Keating makes use of the archaeological digs in the near east as an analogy of the spiritual journey. When ancient armies conquered a city and burned it down, they just built the new city on top. Dig down a few feet and you find another "layer" of civilization.

In the spiritual life, we can uncover our previous incarnations and process whatever losses we
were too buzy surviving to grieve at the time. As these issues surface we will heal through the backlog of denial, anger, bargaining, DEPRESSION and acceptance (Elizabeth Kubler Ross)

The way we experience this may be psychic nausea. There may be memories or there may not be.
The Divine Therapist guides the process and knows just what to heal and the order in which to heal it.

When I think of the way people have been retraumatized by well meaning therapists forcing them to remember things they were not yet ready for, I cringe. The Divine Therapist is so much more gentle. Gentile?

Resisting the natural process or tinkering overmuch with it is likely to bring more depression than I need or want.

Welcome to the new posters in here!
So nice to have others share the trip!

caritas,

miguel

<*))))><

Grace:

I don't want to oversimplify all you've shared re: false self, but it does seem to me that this distinction can become laborious and confusing in and of itself.

I've met several saints from various religious traditions: Hindu, Christian, and Buddhist. I was close to three of the four, and can say with some confidence that these folks were never, ever free of what you're calling the False Self. And they were most especially aware of this; this awareness of their mortality was perhaps the most distictive thing about them, a rather humble, but imperfect quality. They still got angry, still had mental struggles.

What I'm also impressed by is how these people seemed to have had a significant and rather stable early development, and weren't confusing some leftover need for Mommy or Daddy with God, who is in fact Father and Mother. They were imperfect people, but not hypervigilant about all of these distinctions the rest of us seem so careful about making and maintaining. Their company often imparted a sense of peace because they were more at ease with their humanity than most other people. But if you didn't know them for their religious affiliations you would have just enjoyed them as people, maybe even overlooked them.

I suppose it's inevitable that the semantics of this kind of discussion need to be properly clarified. Perhaps it would help to say that the Arrajs and I are using the term Ego in a Jungian sense; see this page for clarifications. Put simply, the Ego refers to one's sense of being an "I" or the conscious subject of one's life. This is not the false self; it is generally experienced in an affective milieu, howsoever subtle; memory generally retains a "record" of how the "I" experiences affectivity, and we can often access that.
- E.g., you hear a song that reminds you of a special date and experience some of the feelings you had then.
- you think back on a certain time in your life and have a feeling of what your life was then.
- you think back on what happened 2 hrs ago and have a feeling of what that was like corresponding to what you experienced then.

I'm sure you can all relate, as we take for granted such things. . .

. . . until it is lost, which is what we are trying to talk about.

So, for example, one can interact with company and experience a range of feelings when they visit. The next day, you can usually think over some of what went on and experience an affective connection with this past event through the affective dimension stored in memory.

With the loss of what the Arraj's are calling the affective ego, however, there is no such affective recall. You can remember who said what, that you were happy or sad or whatever, but you do not have an affective connection with the past event. It's gone! Dessicated! There is no emotional trace in the memory.

So we're not saying that people who experience this situation display no affectivity: they do, during the situation they're living in the present. . . the whole range of feeling. But once the experience is over, it's over . . . affectively, that is . . . like it never even happened . . . could have been 10 years ago just as well as 15 minutes ago. The empirical Ego/individual-subject-of-attention is still there, alive and well, with all its faculties intact, only it seems to be living in a desert of some kind, deprived of inner movements of affectivity connecting present with past and pointing the way to a future. In my own experience, this has also brought a quieting of the mind so that, unless I am working on some kind of problem or creation, there are no thoughts whatsoever. The mind is silent, which at first is quite disconcerting, but eventually becomes most enjoyable.

I hope this helps to clarify the relation between Ego, affective Ego, false self, and the experience we're trying to describe. Maybe this is one of those kinds of experiences that's impossible to grasp unless one undergoes it to some extent.

w.c., I'm talking about myself, and the Arrajs have this as well. This is not theoretical for us.

I would not say that what I'm describing equates with a loss of selfishness or the false self, however, as vices of all kinds (especially pride) still come into play and must be seen and resisted. That's why I keep trying to say that I'm not talking about the loss of a false self, although there is a change in that experience with the loss of affective memory.

As for marriage and the testimony of a spouse, what my wife sees is my relationship with her in the moments we share, and these do include affectivity, as I have tried to explain. She cannot possibly know my inner experience when I am not with her and uninvolved in activities. I've told her about all this, but see no point in making a big deal out of it with her. I don't know what gurus' wives would say to disprove their husbands' claims, but my wife could certainly give witness that I am no perfect person on any level. I have no illusions about that. That's not what I'm talking about at all.

I broached this topic 14 years ago in my kundalini book, but it never even got a nibble in comparison to the kundalini vs. Holy Spirit discussions. I don't think it's the same thing Bernadette Roberts is describing either, for she's actually saying there's no subject of attention present in her experience and I'm quite sure there is one such in mine. I don't fully understand her experience, but it seems similar to that of Suzanne Segal. Others have described the no-self state in a manner similar to what we are calling the loss of affective ego, so there is a touchpoint there.

I think discerning "the point" of this is partly why the Arrajs opened the discussion. In my own case, I have noted some of the practical benefits in posts above. All in all, it's a very positive development, I would say, especially in terms of making available to one greater freedom to exercise the will according to one's values and decisions. There is a very definite "death" or sense of loss that comes with the shift, however, and that takes some getting used to.

w.c, as Phil put it correctly the Ego is not false self. Ego is the outer face of the soul, unfortinately this face of the soul is clouded by the false self or untransformed ego. Soul is grounded in God and God lives in present. Since false self is seperated from God it can't operate in present. Its focus is past and future. False self instead of using present as its starting point it uses as a transit place passing from past to the future. By doing this it always miss God. The good news is this false self is not a permanent part of our being, it is possible to transform it. Redemption is possible. When it is transformed all the emotions and memory the false self has been identified with cease to exist. The memories continues to exist but there is no identification with them. If I understand Phil correctly I think it is this emotions and memory (the false self has identified with) which Arajs called affective ego.

w.c, acting from the past differs gigantically from acting from the present. Nevertheless, the person who started a new life by acting from the present is not free from doing a mistakes sometimes fatal mistakes. Nevertheless, it is important to highlight that these mistakes and wrongdoings are not intentional and is not used in defence of false self.

In my experience I observe Nature with the absence of emotions and memories. In the absence of identification with emotions and memories or loss of affective ego in the word of Arrajs, Nature displays differently. Observing this new reality is refreshing and joyful.

In my experience false self exist side by side with true self. But it is under the control of true self. It has its limited area where it can move freely. If it is inclined to violate the boundry the true self hinders it. One can ask what is the limited movement of false self. I can be angry, sad etc.. In such kind of condition it can move but there is no any inclination towards that memory or one never fall back to those memories once it is done. During this process the false self wanted back to its old habit but the true self hinders it. Consequently, instead of falling back to memories one arrive in a void place where the mind is calm. This void is not as empty as it sounds. In the absense of noisy memories and emotions the mind regain its natural energy to become calm. The mind charged with this energy is ready to act again. If you throw a stone to calm sea what will happen? It create waves and calm down again. It is just like that. I would say this is the essence of meditation.

Since I'm in a transformative period I don't know if the existence of false self side by side with true self is permanent or not.

As we say, "a picture is worth a thousand words." The picture I hold in my mind is the Jesus portrayed by Bruce Marchiano in The Matthew Film.
I'm so greatful to have had this Jesus modeled for me. He laughs, he cries, rages and hugs and kisses and embraces people. Fully human, fully alive. This is the GodMan and the Kingdom is available to such as these...
caritas,

michael
<*))))><

Grace, it sounds like some of what you're describing is along the lines of what the Arrajs mean by the loss of the affective ego, at least with respect to the false self experience. You note:
When it is transformed all the emotions and memory the false self has been identified with cease to exist. The memories continues to exist but there is no identification with them. If I understand Phil correctly I think it is this emotions and memory (the false self has identified with) which Arajs called affective ego.

Yes, that's correct, but only partly so, for the loss of affective memory includes not only those connected with false self conditioning, but even the healthier ones as well. Affective memory and the Ego's attunement to it goes beyond the false self, including even memories of a more positive nature! I hope that helps to clarify.

What is left, then? The desert . . . profound aridity . . . emotional detachment . . . a silent mind . . . the flowering of the senses . . . and, eventually, a deepening sensitivity to subtle movements of life within and about. With this comes increased capacity to live in the present moment, including the experience whatever affectivity such action awakens. And so, Michael, there is no contradiction with the image of Jesus that you note, as there is affectivity, but it does not resonate with any kind of affective memory. That's the nuance.

I've noted all this in previous posts, but let me add, here, that the loss of the affective Ego DOES mean the end of the compulsivities originating in false self conditioning. That's a pretty big deal, imo, and a great healing indeed! It also spells the end of shame, existential anxiety, and resentment, for all these emotions are of the past and are therefore part of the affective memory. Granted, there are degrees of healing from these bitter poisons, but in my own case, I would say that I have been over 90% free of these for almost 20 years! I did not believe this was possible, and for the first few years, kept expecting their return. I also saw how much the false self derives its energies and intentions from these poisonous emotions. After they are healed, one is relatively free of the false self, but not completely.

Sometime early in this healing process -- about 18 years ago or so -- I was given to see the truth of a basic teaching about evil: that pride came before shame with Lucifier and in Eden. Even after the emotional engines of the false self are purged, there mental and spiritual aspects to contend with, and they are often very insidious. Perhaps it is these that have been the undoing of certain Eastern teachers who, coming upon the freedom of the disaffected Ego, imagine that they are "home free." My theology helps me keep a more sober outlook about this, and my encounters with the many subtle temptations of pride convince me that even with the healings I have experienced, I am still a fallen/redeemed human being in need of God's saving grace.

Be assured, dear ones, that no claims to be done with the false self/temptations/struggles with evil are being made here, nor is there a denial of the affective experience in the present moment.

Thank you for the preview of coming attractions. I am still attached and addicted. I was just speaking to someone about codependency. Other people can read the official tee shirt which reads, "How am I doing" on the front and "Try harder" on the back How do you get over it? Good question.

I'm still following Keating's 60 years of experience as a monk, abbot and spiritual director. He says perhaps in 200 years psychology and religion may catch up to each other.

He adds psychology to St John of the Cross;

1) spirit of dizziness corresponds to the security/survival center

2) spirit of fornication corresponds to the affection/esteem emotional center

3) spirit of blasphemy corresponds to the power and control center

This would tend to agree with the first three of eight life stages in the developmental psychology of Erik Erickson and New Age gurus like Anodea Judith or Carolyn Myss when they speak of first, second and third chakra deficiencies.

I don't underestimate the power of these emotional centers because I notice that my hero
Thomas Merton was still going off about politics and how the monasteries were run even after many years as a Trappist. He even fell in love with a nurse in the hospital a couple of years before he passed. Ordinary human experience or the emotional centers? I'm not really sure.

I guess that I'll be dealing with these emotional centers for a very long time and I'm greatful that you can provide some experience with victory over them. I praise God for your progress.
No doubt I will camp out on your doorstep and learn from you for a long time to come.

namaste,

michael

<*))))><

What is left, then? The desert . . . profound aridity . . . emotional detachment . . . a silent mind . . . the flowering of the senses . . . and, eventually, a deepening sensitivity to subtle movements of life within and about.

I agree Phil, all this things are the grace of God which automatically become accessible to oss in the aftermath of the loss of affective ego. At this stage it is very crucial to develop solid faith in God to avoid the entanglement of spiritual pride. But we can't produce this faith by effort. It comes naturally as Grace. What the seeker need to do is to leave everything in the hands of the God.

the memory is ordinarily centered on God with painful care and solicitude ... being without anxiety, without the ability and without desire to have experience of Him or to perceive Him ... the functions still work normally when called upon. We think when we need to think, we feel when we need to feel. The problem is not the functions, themselves, but the failure of the energy that spontaneously activated them. Now the functions spring up when circumstances or the will demands, but they immediately withdraw when the job is done.
http://www.innerexplorations.com/catew/cru8.htm

My own concrete expression of this type of experience is captured in some simple affirmations that I often repeat to myself in certain times of quietude: 1) I neither know nor need to know. I neither feel nor need to feel. I love and need to forgive. This all corresponding to faith and hope and love. 2) When we awaken to our solidarity, compassion will ensue. 3) et cetera.

It has seemed to me that such a loss of the affective ego can be placed at the service of a) our ongoing affective conversion (cf. Gelpi on Lonergan) b) individuation (cf. Jung) c) an existential response of affect rather than a neurotic reaction (cf. Peck) d) enlightenment/nondual awareness e) infused contemplation f) et cetera, all distinct but fully integral.

pax,
jb

I hear so much these days about Ego, False Self, Old Nature, Spirit, Soul, etc. etc. Goodness there are so many parts of our "selves"! Well, I think it is all rather confusing, and so I will not even begin to try to figure it out.

I came across this article about meditation, ego, etc.this morning at the web site of Elaine Aron, the "queen" (me calling her that) of HSPs, and author of the HSP "bible", "The Highly Sensitive Person". http://www.hsperson.com/pages/1May04.htm

She is very much "into" Jung.
Her article is quite interesting if you want to check it out.

I didn't even read it all myself. I have information overload. Going to fast from the internet for a while, but if necessary will come here. :-)

Katy

I cannot report a loss of affect as much as I can discern, rather, a tendency for feelings to follow me into action rather than leading me into action.

St. Thomas described how our love of God increases in proportion to our knowledge of God. And this is true.

St. Bernard described how our knowledge of God increases in proportion to our love of God. This, too, is true.

The knowledge of God that St. Bernard describes, however, surpasses that which St. Thomas was speaking and writing about. St. Thomas was talking about that knowledge of God that comes from both natural and supernatural revelation, a discursive knowing that increases through our study of philosophy, metaphysics, theology and such, such a knowing as could never attain to God's essential nature even as it might infinitely advance toward same.

The love of which both Thomas and Bernard spoke of, however, can indeed communicate with God's essential nature, leading one to a mysterious type of knowledge that certainly informs our normative sciences (of logic, aesthetics and ethics) and descriptive sciences (for instance, natural science) but which also far surpasses them, a knowledge difficult to describe or articulate. Such a love, I believe, is experienced on the threshold of contemplation.

Such is the love which casts out all fear. And here is the link to the loss of the affective ego that I'd like to explore. The perfect love that casts out all fear is a love that has grown in dependency on God, has learned to trust God, that knows that, however bad the situation or dire the circumstances, in the final analysis, all will be well. It is the mystical love of Julian that sings all may, can, will and shall be well and is the realization of the promise that you will know that all manner of things will be well. Here, then, is the distinction we draw between existential fear and neurotic fear, existential guilt and neurotic guilt, existential anger and neurotic anger, the existential always in service of life and love and relationship, the neurotic invariably life-detracting, love-detracting, relationship-destroying. We are not dealing only with neuroses that are overcome in the process of individuation but also those sinful resistances to conversion that are overcome on our journey of transformation, distinct but intertwined realities.

So, I would describe the loss of the affective ego as an energy inversion whereby the emotions and feelings and affective life don't so much energize our behaviors by initiating them but rather energize our behaviors by reinforcing them. It seems that this state could be effected all of a sudden through some precipitating event or could arise through time and a habit of virtue.

I will stop here as my thoughts are fogging up, but there is a dynamic of love and surrender that seems to be involved and either a sudden metanoia or a force of habit where this dynamic is concerned?

pax,
jb

Love, eminently reasonable, needs no reason, inasmuch as it is sufficient unto itself. Happiness, finally, cannot be pursued but must ensue. So, too, with good feelings. They aren't needed but will often ensue, which is to say, follow, love.

One of Merton's journal entries remarked that he felt his entire life a charade. He was a failure as a monk, as a priest, as a contemplative, as a writer, etc.
This was toward the end of his life and he just seemed to blossom and be at peace after that. Here is a portrait of someone who is really getting over his "stuff," his self concept. No wonder the Tibetans told him he was "very close" to enlightenment. namaste <*))))>< mm

I came to share an afterthought re: something that Merton had said, this prior to finding Michael's sharing a la Merton, which was very good.

Merton noted that often, when we are in pain and conflict and contradiction, we incorrectly associate same with old wounds, with old injuries that truly have been resolved and healed already. During such times, Merton encourages us to consider the very real possibility that we are, rather, being invited to open ourselves to a new level of being through such pain and conflict and contradiction. In other words, if we are not properly attentive, then we run the risk of stagnation, desolation and aridity, sometimes for months or years, dwelling on the wrong integrative and transformative issues, missing the invitation to move to another level, a level that could be attained in a day even.

One of the chief obstacles to advancing in the spiritual life, then, is to gain a certain clarity of vision regarding the route to sanctity or to psychological integration (routes that are much intertwined) and then acting as if the vision itself is the attainment when, in fact, it is not the mapping of the journey that marks our growth but the walking of the road, which is to say that, if you are on the illuminative or unitive way, then get on with it, and so on. Further, the mapping never involves the entire journey but entails, rather, our next good step, a step which is the spiritual equivalent of taking the entire journey Thus it is that the entire road is traversed, one step at a time in faith with the trust that that step is truly what is required for now, for today. We can get caught up with seeing the road and then fail to walk it, is our constant peril.

Two lessons here: Sometimes one has to quit beating one's head against the wall just because it feels good when you stop. Sometimes one has to quit circling the same developmental block on the journey just because some of the signs look the same, which is to say that emotional memories can get in the way by misleading us into thinking that our pain is rooted in old unresolved issues when it is moreso about leading us in a new direction entirely (with a genesis in new issues), inviting us to another level entirely. Then, once we see this new direction, it is of the essence to WALK it and not merely content ourselves in the consolation of SEEING it!

Well, this is a very loose rendering of the meaning I gathered from Merton and any misconstructions are my own. I will leave it to the forum to sort through how the integration/transformation of the affective ego fits in, for that may be a better way of describing what I think is going on in what is being called the loss of the affective ego. Point is that old emotional memories can get improperly associated with new spiritual emergence issues and that we can misdiagnose the reason for our present pain, conflict and contradiction.

pax,
jb

Good reflections w.c. Yes, it is good to leave the mind alone when it compare, analyse etc. Don't cooperate with it, don't attach with it and see what happen without anticipating. Let me tell you how my mind react during the moment of meditation.

During meditation even during a deep meditation my mind is calm but it doesn't stop to move, it asks various questions like what kind of light is it? what kind of energy is it? Is it our universe? I don't cooperate with it but I see it as part of universe floating like a leaf. In a deep meditation I surrender totally and this scared the mind and asks many questions. I don't respond but I observe its desperate struggle to grasp the divine power which is totally beyond its capacity.