quote:

Originally posted by Phil:
Yes, Bob, all very interesting and mysterious, for sure.

I do not think experiences such as you've shared and I've written about are very common (though I've heard from numerous people through the years who've described a wide variety of energy phenomena), nor do I believe that this was what Jesus had in mind when he spoke of baptizing us in the Holy Spirit and fire.
It's more likely that the "fire" reference is to charismatic spirituality, which was common in the early Church (and in some Christian groups today) and which is often (not always) accompanied by kundalini phenomena. And so I have resisted going along with teachings that draw and equivalence between k and the Holy Spirit, noting that the gifts and fruits of the Spirit are obvious in many, many Christians who show no signs of k.

Hi Phil,
Yes, these experiences are very unusual.
And there seems to be a lot of Charismatic teachings on the third phase of Baptism. But I think they may be taking one aspect (ie., fire being very "fired up for God etc,) but missing the energy that is akin to fire.
There are overlaps to these three aspects of baptism. I believe the baptism of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost was the Baptism of air. It came with the sound of a rushing mighty wind, yet there were "tongues" of flame involved.
In Noah's ark which is a type of baptism a dove was let loose. (Air) and when it returned the second time it had an olive branch. (fire, the olives that would later come would be used to make the oil that burned in the lamps.)
Some in attendance at Pentecost scoffed. Some were performing miracles and some were aware of signs in the heaven and wonders in the earth.
I am not equating the Holy Spirit with Kundalini as the same thing or equal. The way I am looking at it is a step in a process that the Spirit is performing in us. This process opens our awareness to what reality is. It is waking us up or bringing us back to life. A deep sleep was put on Adam when Eve was taken out of his side. It never says he woke up. This is the splitting of our soul from our spirit. Adam is mankind.
God said we would die if we ate of the fruit of the Tree of the knowledge of good and Evil.
We did. We, as mankind, dont't believe it because we have nothing to compare it with. Everyone died and everyone believes themselves to be alive.

During the first phase of the cleansing/waking up process (water)we begin to become aware of signs and wonders. Coincidences happen. The bible begins to open to us etc. and we see things happen or people talking about things we are wondering about just when we need to know those things. Synchronicities, etc. This can be a "flood" of sorts. The "windows of heaven opened during the flood. The windows of heaven also opened in the book of Malachi and it said the blessings that were poured out were too great to recieve. This can be a frightening experience.

The second phase of this process, (air) which is in it's entirety a cleansing process, makes us more aware of where these things are coming from. Jesus breathed on the apostles and the scriptures were opened up to them. If God is doing this to us, it makes all the difference. Saints and crazy people have a lot in common. But a person experiencing a flood of reaffirmations has no peace, only fear.
I would equate this phase to Jacob's ladder. He had a vision/dream and when he awoke he realized "Surely, the Lord is in this place and I knew it not." He called the place Bethel or House of God. It was not a place geographically speaking, it was a Spiritual awareness. An awakening.
"This place" was a consciousness that our consciousness is the Gate of Heaven and the house of God.
This awareness was promised to Nathanael when Jesus first met him. He told Nathanael that he would see greater things. Angels of God ascending and descending upon the son of man..."
If you do the Gematria on the phrase "Behold, a ladder set up" in the story of Jacob's ladder, it adds up to the name of Jesus in Greek. 888.
So Jesus was promising Nathanael that he was going to experience the same Spiritual experience that Jacob had experienced. This promise, I believe, was fulfilled at Pentecost.
I also believe that the promise made to John and James was fulfilled in Scripture by the experience John related in the book of Revelation.

This leads to the third phase of baptism, which is fire. In this phase we see, not only consciousness being further enhanced and awakened, but physical matter being affected. Both in miraculous happenings at and after Pentecost by the apostles and other disciples and also by changes in the physical bodies, which we are discussing here.

quote:

My general sense is that k is something of an overlow of spiritual energy into the body and the "etheric" interface between body and soul. You hardly ever find k phenomena apart from charismatic spirituality or intense meditation practices such as you described. So I'm hesitant to go along with the idea that this is something Jesus intended for everyone, even though the fruit of it can be very good.

Jesus may not have intended it for everybody. If we are baptized into Christ we are saved. That everyone be saved, I think is the Father's intention and will.
Some wish to take it further or God wishes them to. In the body of Christ there are eyes and ears and hands and feet.
Man is body soul and spirit. Paul said the Spirit bears witness with our spirit that we are sons of God and fellow heirs with Christ.
So what did Jesus have as the Son of God? Nothing he said or did came from himself, but from the Father. We also can have that same relationship with the Father as fellow heirs with Christ.
How far we take that depends on how much of ourselves we are willing to give up.
Baptism is a threshold experience.

Elijah heard the still small voice of God at the opening of a cave. Lazarus came forth at the opening of a cave and was loosed from his grave wrapping and death. The angel at the doorway of the tomb of Jesus said "Why seek you the living among the dead?"

These things apply to us. The bible as merely a history book has very little use for us.
When applied to us we begin to see that it was not only written to us and for us, but about us.
It is the roadmap. Many times we do not understand it until we experience it and then we begin to recognise ourselves and our experiences within the pages.
The first thing that Jesus did when he came out of the wilderness is to find himself in scripture and declare it in the synagogue.

quote:

When did you have the awakening experience described above? Have you ever had a "repeat" or something similar?

Not similar. It was about 30 years ago. I have never been caught up to that place again. But I know what I did to get there, though it may not be up to me anyway. It was a gift.
And when I approach that meditation I do have to do it with a certain amount of caution.
The "side effects" can be difficult to deal with as many of you know.
I have had other experiences. Visions, visitations, and some very oddball things, which have not always come during meditation, but what I have come to learn is that the experience itself is not the important thing. What we learn from the experience is what is important.

I have not had too many of those types of things in years, but the awarenesses and understanding of the scriptures has continued to open. And that is the important thing to me.

Have a great day,
Bob

Hi Bliss,

quote:

Originally posted by BlissInTheHeart:
Hi Bob !
Your experiences are very inspiring and fascinating to me. Thanks for writing them here.

[QUOTE] The fire is what interests me. The threefold cleansing makes it possible to become more aware of the things of God. But not many people seem to write about this. Most that I've come across seem to think the baptism that Jesus was baptised with and that he promised to James and John was a baptism of suffering. But few seem to know about the fire.

quote:

What do you mean by "threefold cleansing".
And the "three phases of baptism .... Water Air and Fire. " Can you tell us something about that ?

I am basing that on John the Baptist's statement:
Mt 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:

I also stated some of my reasoning in the last post. I am trying to see based on my own experiences and the scripture what these things mean. When I and a small group at my old church were baptized years ago we noticed thaty we began to see all kinds of coincidences happening to us. Way beyond coincidence. We had all been believers before these things began happening, but there was no denying what was happening. Except by other church members who were not baptized.
It lead to a lot of problems and a splitting of our church.
Our small group started referring to what was happening as a flood. Later I came to see that it was actually what the flood of Noah was all about.
The bible is written on many levels. Hebrew scholars say that these levels are literal, implied, allegorical and Mystical (or hidden)
I have always approached scripture with the mindset that "I do not understand all that this is telling me."
This leaves me open for more to come.
I recently was at a baptising in the Philippines. When it was to bring the Holy Spirit down on the child, the priest asked us to touch its feed. Reminded me on an earth grounding in case of k problems (???). Later when i asked around, people told me that this is a common practise there.

quote:

Heat sensations seem to be not such a seldom side effect of k. I heard that often, and i experienced this too, even when it was some time ago. Fortunately not while digestion, but mostly at my right leg. Seems to be an intense purification process, a process that is going the hard, but fast way.

And i had the impression that this was managed "from the Beyond" An example: The heat mostly started right after my morning meditation. While driving to my job my right leg began increasingly to burn with such a strong sensation like i was standing right in the middle of a fire. And this stopped within a second exactly at this moment when i arrived at my work and got out of my car !!!! Pure coincidence ?

I mentioned in my last post the concept of finding yourself in scripture. My teacher had always referred to the bible as a roadmap or "Mystic's handbook."
The first time I understood what this meant was after seeing an angel in meditation. He just appeared in a flash in front of me. Later on, for months afterwards, I found it difficult to meditate because of a aggravating pain in the inner portion of my left thigh. I think they are calling it restless leg syndrome these days. I stopped meditating for a few years.
One day, while reading the bible, I came across the story of Jacob.
These words jumped out at me.
"He halted on his thigh!"
That is exactly what I had done. I had halted,..stopped all meditation, because of a pain in my thigh. Also the exact place and character of that pain was further described in other places. It said the "Sinew which was shortened" which is exactly what it felt like. KLike I could not get the inside of my thigh long enough.
There is a major nerve running through this portion of the thigh. Phil probably knows what it is called.
When I realized what was happening I went to my teacher and asked if that was what he meant by the bible being a roadmap. He said it was.
Like I said, that was the first time that I found myself in scripture and it really shook me up.
But, like I said we don't always understand these things or recogise them in the bible until after we have an experience and then the scripture speaks directly to us.

quote:

There are also some writings about this heat in christian literature. For instance in the diaries of Sr. Faustina. Unfortunately she didnt write about her spiritual beginnings, but "only"
when she was already very advanced. She had this burning too sometimes, on the whole body to such an extend that she wondered how it could be that she was surviving that. But in her case it was not for a cleansing of herself, but for purification of the sins and karma of other people. Again managed from the Beyond, from Jesus himself.

Yes, that is the kind of thing I am looking for. I think it may be Paul's "thorn in the flesh" also.

quote:

You said that after leaving through your head the burning was still there, even without a body ! Very interesting ! Did you have the feeling that then, without body, the burning has increased, stayed the same, or has diminished ?

Once I got to that "plateau" where I stopped "going up" I was able to clam myself and just observe, which is how I was taught to approach all things in meditation both physical and mind/emotional. At that point the heat and roaring took on a positive tone and there was no body to shake apart. Then the heat became pure joy/ecstacy and the sound became praise.

quote:

Reminds me of a Near Death Experience where this person, a very christian relgious one, was shown the purgatory by Jesus . (Of coarse NDEs are always individual, such also this kind of purgatory.) He saw souls in a very hot place on the right side, staying there so long till they couldnt stand it anymore, and then they were put in a very cold place on the left side, so long till they couldnt stand this again any more. Then back to the hot place, etc, etc, etc.
Now this reminds me on Kundalini. According to the Hindu theory there are 3 principle nerves through which the k is flowing up the colon spine: Ida, Pingala, and Sushumna. Sushumna is the middle nerve, through which the k usualy should flow up. Then you have the least problems with k. Big problems can arise, when the k is rising up on the right side (Pingala nerve, male, associated with the sun, heat)or on the left side (Ida nerve, female, associated with the moon, coldness ). And these souls in the purgatory were experiencing alternatively heat and cold ! As a cleansing ! (Btw, Gopi Krishna said that his k arouse through the "hot" nerve, Pingala.)

My teacher had some different ideas on K.
He was adamant that the energy came from above and came down and turned and then rose.
Gopi Krishna never got back to that place of cosmic consciousness, after the first two tries when it almost killed him twice. And that the only reason he was able to shut it down was because he put his consciousness on the tailbone, while trying to switch from the cold to the hot or visa versa. He had opened it by concentrating on the crown, he was able to shut it down by concentrating on the root chakra.
My teacher said that the only way to master it was to touch on it and then back off. In other words learn to turn it on and off. A person cannot survive the full power for long.
My teacher said that

quote:

Another question: Is your heart chakra also involved somehow in your k process ?

Of course. It is where I love God from.
We love Him because he first loved us.
The geneology from Abraham to Christ are awarenesses we go through on our way to him.
Again, the idea of a threefold cleansing or "circumcision" of the heart.
From Abraham to David and from David to the captiuvity in Babylon and from the captivity in Babylon to Christ. 14 years each.
Abraham= belif in the promise of another city and in the invisible.
David= Blesseed is the man who's sin is not held against him= God's Grace.
Babylon= confusion, which is where we are, on our way to Christ. The confusion of tongues at Babel (manmade tower made of manmade bricks) was lifted at Pentecost when the confusion of tongues was reversed for those who would accept it.
Christ= I and the Father are one.

I look at the heart chakra as the fuel that draws me closer to God and Jesus and directs the energy sexual and otherwise to higher use. Paul said whatever things are pure, honorable holy etc,.. think on these. The heart center helps tremendously in this, whether in medtation or throughout the day.

Also, it just occurred to me. When this experience happened to me it was not as if the energy came into my heat and down to the tailbone area.
It came down and it turned to heat in my feet first and then began to fill me from the feet up.

quote:

Best wishes for you on your way to God !

Thank you. Best wishes to you too. You might want to look more closely at the story of Jacob and see if anything jumps out at you.


Bob

Bob, I'm enjoying your sharing, along with Bliss's as well. You were lucky to find a teacher who had knowledge of k and Christianity as well.

I find myself agreeing with the general spirit of what you're sharing and much of the content as well. It seems to be an anagogical approach and, as you noted, that's part of a full understanding of scripture (along with literal/historical, allegorical and moral approach). This is a missing dimension for many Christians.

One little nit to pick, here, is your point about Adam going to sleep when the Lord brought forth Eve from one of his ribs, and it's never reported that he woke up. I think it's implied from Gen. 2: 23-25 that Adam did wake up and rejoiced because of his new partner. V. 25 notes that they were naked and felt no shame. They were both awake in the Lord, but still innocent in the ways of sin. It's with their eating of the forbidden fruit that they brought sin into the world, and with it, death, and spiritual sleep as well. To my understanding, "sleep" in the sense of dulled awareness has more to do with sin than the creation of woman.

quote:

I have had other experiences. Visions, visitations, and some very oddball things, which have not always come during meditation, but what I have come to learn is that the experience itself is not the important thing. What we learn from the experience is what is important.

Very good point. It does seem like the process itself nudges us in the direction we need to be moving, sometimes by creating negative consequences when we are moving the wrong way.

quote:

Originally posted by Phil:
Bob, I'm enjoying your sharing, along with Bliss's as well. You were lucky to find a teacher who had knowledge of k and Christianity as well.

I find myself agreeing with the general spirit of what you're sharing and much of the content as well. It seems to be an anagogical approach and, as you noted, that's part of a full understanding of scripture (along with literal/historical, allegorical and moral approach). This is a missing dimension for many Christians.

Hi Phil and all,
I'm not sure what you mean by anagogical.
an·a·go·ge also an·a·go·gy (n-gj)
n. pl. an·a·go·ges also an·a·go·gies
A mystical interpretation of a word, passage, or text, especially scriptural exegesis that detects allusions to heaven or the afterlife
Ok, yes mystical.
Literal, implied, alegorical and mystical.
Most churches/sermons/teachings that I have had contact with go as far as implied.
Some touch on alegory. a story behind a story,..symbols point to other symbols. And you have to know what the symbols means in order to understand the story.
The parabel of the seed and the sower is a very good example of Jesus teaching on this. And demonstrates these levels of understanding scripture.

When I first read this story,..Jesus is the sower. He is expounding his "doctrine." His seed is planted throughout the world and changes things. All true.
Then he says to his disciples (us, because there is only one teacher and we are his disciples)that if they did not understand this parable how could they understand all parables.
So the field and the seed and the sower and weeds choking all apply to other parables,..it is a "model" parable. Very true.
Later, this bothered me for one reason. There aren't enough symbols there to explain all parables, what he is teaching them here is Alegory Itself. If we do not understand Alegory we cannot understand all parables (which would also include the law and prophets)This is the third level and it is also true.

Now just in the past year or so, another, deeper aspect to this parable has opened up to me. Jesus said that to these "disciples" he was giving them the "mysteries." To them that were "without", they were not given these "Mysteries." Not only was he teaching them the alegories and allegory itself, but he was telling them which symbols meant what in the story behind the story.
The forth level of understanding scripture,"Mystical", is given by Jesus to his disciples, US. And this level is definitely true. And more importantly it is true for us.
The Holy Spirit/Comforter will bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have told you."
Jesus said this. He also said he will speak of me. The word becomes alive at this point.
This is the meaning of "If my words abide in you" "Abide" means to live. To be alive.
When the word opens from one level of understanding to another level, it is if the words became alive. They always were. It is just that we are waking up to that truth.
This is the fulfillment of a promise that Jesus made to us. Not merely the few disciples that were with him on that day. But to those who would believe they would be taught by him.
There is one teacher and we are but disciples.

quote:

One little nit to pick, here, is your point about Adam going to sleep when the Lord brought forth Eve from one of his ribs, and it's never reported that he woke up. I think it's implied from Gen. 2: 23-25 that Adam did wake up and rejoiced because of his new partner. V. 25 notes that they were naked and felt no shame. They were both awake in the Lord, but still innocent in the ways of sin. It's with their eating of the forbidden fruit that they brought sin into the world, and with it, death, and spiritual sleep as well. To my understanding, "sleep" in the sense of dulled awareness has more to do with sin than the creation of woman.

The "original Sin" as I see it is a change in polarity. You have mentioned it in your book, I believe.
Adam is mankind created in the image of God. Operating as we should, as we were meant to operate. As the angels in heaven,..no males and females. Both male and female in one.
Eve (the soul) was taken from Adam (the Spirit in man).
Here is where the polarity or flow got messed up. Our souls (the souls of all mankind) began to influence our spirits based upon this cause and effect world. We were acting outside of the Grace of God which comes down from above.
Paul said "His spirit bear witness to our spirit that we are the sons of God."
God's Spirit
Our spirit
Our soul
Our body
That is the correct flow. Restored as it was at the begining. How we were created to operate.
In my opinion there were no males or females until we recieved "coats of skins."

Mankind is either "asleep" or "dead" until we begin to hear.
Joh 5:25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
The word Voice implies living. Not necessarily a audible voice but a knowing that comes on us while reading a certain verse or even out in the world. This, I believe is the Earnest of the Spirit. Like earnest money, a surety that a contract/covenant is being fulfilled.
You have also alluded to having experienced this, also in your book.

quote:

I have had other experiences. Visions, visitations, and some very oddball things, which have not always come during meditation, but what I have come to learn is that the experience itself is not the important thing. What we learn from the experience is what is important.

quote:

Very good point. It does seem like the process itself nudges us in the direction we need to be moving, sometimes by creating negative consequences when we are moving the wrong way.

The type of meditation I have practiced I always avoided visualization or mantras or phenomenon of any kind. Silently reaching for God, I guess you would call it.
This way we can avoid a lot of the collective unconscious symbology.
And when something happens it carries a lot more weight because it is coming from a higher source and unmistakeable in that respect.
God does chastise those He loves, but only for a cleansing process. So that we can know Him more intimately.
Peace on Earth, Good will toward men. That was the announcement of good things to come. Toward men, not between men as it has come to mean to most.

Have a great day Phil and all,
Bob

Bob, I can tell that you enjoy teaching on spiritual matters. There is an urgent need for good teaching on that mystical dimension of the scriptures, and some of what you've shared I agree with; other parts I have reservations about, That's OK; we don't need to have complete agreement on all matters, and going too far into a comparing notes would detract from the thread topic. Perhaps another discussion topic?

quote:

The type of meditation I have practiced I always avoided visualization or mantras or phenomenon of any kind. Silently reaching for God, I guess you would call it.
This way we can avoid a lot of the collective unconscious symbology.
And when something happens it carries a lot more weight because it is coming from a higher source and unmistakeable in that respect.

I can relate to this, especially the silent reaching for God, which is the heart of contemplative practice. I do use a few words of praise to re-focus attentiveness to God, when necessary, and there is often glossalalia as well (it comes and goes). This kind of prayer has sustained me for years and I cannot imagine living without it.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Phil,

quote:

Originally posted by Phil:
Bob, I can tell that you enjoy teaching on spiritual matters. There is an urgent need for good teaching on that mystical dimension of the scriptures, and some of what you've shared I agree with; other parts I have reservations about, That's OK; we don't need to have complete agreement on all matters, and going too far into a comparing notes would detract from the thread topic. Perhaps another discussion topic?

Hi Phil'
Another thread might be good. I don't mean to detract from this one.
And I don't consider myself a teacher. Just sharing some experiences.
And hoping some experiences are mutually confirming. Some in your book were for me.
The idea that you mentioned on one of these threads, for instance, that the gift of Prophecy is not merely seeing the future has also occured to me. New Covenant wise, God said that he wished all of His children were prophets. It speaks of interpreting the scriptures in the light of what has already happened as opposed to the OT perspective of what would be coming in their future.

In the mouth of two or three witnesses let every word be extablished. If we see others going through the same things we are we can then keep our eyes open while we are reading scripture and begin to recognise some patterns that I believe are there to guide us in these K. experiences and awarenesses.

The reason I came to this forum was in looking for more info on the baptism of Fire.
I have frequented a couple of other forums but what seems to be missing is the personal experiences with the K. energy and linking of awarenesses related to it. And this in from a Christian perspective.
It is difficult to separate how we got to where we are in our understanding from how we see things presently.

quote:

The type of meditation I have practiced I always avoided visualization or mantras or phenomenon of any kind. Silently reaching for God, I guess you would call it.
This way we can avoid a lot of the collective unconscious symbology.
And when something happens it carries a lot more weight because it is coming from a higher source and unmistakeable in that respect.

I can relate to this, especially the silent reaching for God, which is the heart of contemplative practice. I do use a few words of praise to re-focus attentiveness to God, when necessary, and there is often glossalalia as well (it comes and goes). This kind of prayer has sustained me for years and I cannot imagine living without it.[/QUOTE]

Our minds can only think one thing at a time. Be still and know that I am God is a key. Maybe the key. Our words, whether verbalized or in our minds, create, in a sense, our reality.
Don Juan, the Yaqui indian seer/sorcerer said that "stopping the internal dialog" was the single most important thing that he had taught Carlos Castaneda, his apprentice. It was the key to the experience he called "stopping the world."

Jesus said;
Lu 19:40 And he answered and said unto them, "I tell you that, if these should hold their peace, the stones would immediately cry out."

If I have trouble stopping the talking I listen to the sound of my breathing.
Some use mantras.
Speaking in unknown tongues may also serve the same purpose.
Keeping our minds focused without adding any meaning to our minds which can tend to keep us seeing realty the same way we have always seen it.

Anyway I'm going off on rabbit trails here.
Let me know where and what the thread will be moved to.

Bob

quote:

The reason I came to this forum was in looking for more info on the baptism of Fire.
I have frequented a couple of other forums but what seems to be missing is the personal experiences with the K. energy and linking of awarenesses related to it. And this in from a Christian perspective.

The first draft of my kundalini book was entitled The Holy Spirit and Fire, my thinking at the time being that k was another phase of baptism in the Spirit. It seems to be that way for some, especially in the Christian tradition. Of course, there are those who show signs of k awakening outside of Christianity and they've not received baptism by water or the Spirit, at least not in a formal, sacramental sense. My thinking has evolved to where I now think these are all separate but potentially related kinds of "baptisms," with the most essential being baptism by water (or at least desire), as that's the one that establishes us as members of Christ's mystical body. The Holy Spirit and all the gifts are given with the baptism by water, and what we call "baptism of the Spirit" is more a deeper surrender to the Spirit, and k awakening can be another level of surrender as well. I do think that those who have not received baptism of the Spirit and K are missing out on some wonderful benefits, but I don't think them to be asleep or second-rate Christians, by any means; they possess sufficient awareness to make responsible decisions, to love, to serve as God calls them.

Internet discussion threads ramble, and I'll just leave this one as it is. You can start a new discussion through the "New" tab on a forum page in any forum you'd like, or maybe tap into an already-open topic similar to what you'd like to discuss, as you did with this one.

Hi Bliss,
Thank you for the links. I will look into those.
I have had some experiences that match some of the desciptions you have listed.
These things do not seem to happen in the same order as John gives the three aspects of Baptism.
Water, spirit (air) and fire. In other words it is not necessarily linear.
I have come to the conclusion (at least at this point in time) that the Pentecost was the air aspect.
Yet the order in which we experience these things may not be as John the Baptist stated.
I mentioned the fire/overwhelming heat above. It was one day after seeing and angel appear to me.
Several years later I saw something which is very reminiscent of the Transfiguration. The very next day I experienced what was unmistakeably the Coat of Many Colors. (which I would also equate with the vision of Jacob's ladder and the Pentecost (air) experience.
This was "established" to me in scripture much later on in the words of Joseph to Pharoah.

Ge 41:25 And Joseph said unto Pharaoh, The dream of Pharaoh is one: God hath showed Pharaoh what he is about to do.

Ge 41:32 And for that the dream was doubled unto Pharaoh twice; it is because the thing is established by God, and God will shortly bring it to pass.

The four visions/experiences that I had were "one" they were doubled twice. Two on consecutive days and then again two on consecutive days years later.

The second vision seemed to be the "source" of the fire. The ocean of energy.
The forth was columns or bands of colored light that reached up as high as I could imagine, continued down through me and through the earth. But there were multi-colored flames shaped by the letter Yod. "Cloven tongues of fire" that rose and fell on and through me and moved like butterflies. They did not rest on my head, but, as it were, a "flock" of butterflies would come to "rest" in a certain place in a field or on a certain bush.
It felt like a coat surrounding me.
It was a beautiful experience and I felt the love of God. There were flames but no heat as in the other experience I described. Just the knowledge that God loved me. Sonship, inheritance is designated by the Coat of Many Colors.

Many synchronicities followed this experience, and the vision that happened the day before it, which resembled the Transfiguration. Certain phrases in the Scripture also made sense because of these visions and some pointed directly to these visions, describing what had happened.
At Pentecost there were "signs in the heavens and wonders in the earth."
This was mentioned in Acts "in addition to" the miracles because it was pointing to something "other than" the miracles.
So, though there were flames involved, I believe this experience and Pentecost (which, again came with the sound of a rushing, mighty wind), point to the Air aspect of the one Baptism.

Again, Thanks for the links,
Bob