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hi!
I've been wondering about dualsima nd how this realtes to jung. if illness and a lack of wholeness come from not recognising or pushing our "other" side away then to embrace all aspects of character is surely good? how the, does this relate to the christian idea that we aspie, through accepting grace and also discipoline to move beyond certain aspects of ourselves? Is evil a lack of good or is it an actual force? do we acknowledge the darker aspects of our own psyche and therefore keep it in check or are all apects the shadow side of what we consciously understand? sorry if this is a bit rambly and confused it ties into a lot of bigger discussions im sure...
Rachel

Lots of big questions, there, Rachel. I think we'll end up touching on some of them as we go along, so hang in there. By the end of the class, we'll be developing some of the theological implications of Jung's approach.

I can say that in tomorrow's lesson, we'll cover the developmental aspect of type development. One of the things you'll note is that getting in touch with the "other side" of our personality is not so easy to do when we're young, as it's buried in the unconscious. So I don't think illness is related to that kind of lack of integration in young people as most are healthy without this integration and they couldn't do much about it anyway. More on all this later.

Phil

I wasn't sure where to put an account of a very vivid dream I had a week ago so here it goes! . It had that quality that remains with a certain nouminousness (if thats a word!). I have only had two other dreams of the same kind of sense of mystery. In this one I went to the top of my friend's building and then I discovered a mirror, while looking into it I realised that I was a man. This didnt frighten or shock me but seemed quite normal. I was then looking for a very specific wooden bowl which seemed like it would provide me with peace and contentment if I could find it. Then authority figure, in this case my boss appeared and I felt very frustrated and wanted him to leave so i could continue looking for the bowl.Instead I looked in a cupboard and found a very elaborate map which seemd to be an "alien"'s theory of evolution. I then heard a voice saying that this was a talisman.

on a bit of a side question, I think I am ENF but unsure about the J/P section. If the prcess of individuation is a natural one, is trying to become more like the subconscious aspects of the personality actually working against the process, as its a way of trying to control rather than reflect?

Being an N I alays have a million ideas but usually lack the discipline,focus and patience to follow through which is really frustating as it means things never reach their full potential. Is trying to be more focused actually surpressing my natural functions rather than working with them?

any comments appreciated! please excuse my terrible typing i sprained my arm snowboarding and its only just now out of a sling!

Rachel, I think some of the symbols in your dream have archetypal significance.

The male in the mirror = your unconscious, masculine side; the Animus.

The bowl is a symbol of the Self; roundness, contains and holds the psyche.

Your boss sounds like a Superego symbol -- do's, don'ts, oughts, rewards.

You might reflect on how these symbols are relating in the dream, and what that all tells you about your present inner situation.

Keep working your way through the lessons; it can help to clarify your type, especially if two of the letters are close. That often indicates the 2nd and 3rd functions, which are probably equally developed even at your young age. Read through the different possibilities at http://www.typelogic.com and see what fits. If you can at least get a good read on your primary type, that's a great start. Sometimes it takes awhile to determine one's type.

Lesson 8 probably addresses some of your questions about working with the unconscious and developing your opposite side. I don't think being more focused and aware counterproductive, however. This is a challenge for all the types, unless it bleeds over into an unnatural rigidity and effort to control our attention.

quote:

Originally posted by Phil St. Romain:
Lots of big questions, there, Rachel. I think we'll end up touching on some of them as we go along, so hang in there. By the end of the class, we'll be developing some of the theological implications of Jung's approach.

Just a footnote re: Jung. I'll be interested in hearing your take on Helminiak's "correction" of Jung, especially re: evil and coincidence of opposites and such. [Helminiak is someone we've discussed on the public Shalomplace Boards, for those unfamiliar.]

pax,
jb

For those interested in the issues Jung raises about evil (and much more): Jung and Theology by Jim Arraj. I'll look forward to the discussion that Phil said he'll initiate later re: theological implications. Meanwhile, I will say this: Jim Arraj is right on.

pax!
jb

This message relates to careers. The fact is, it has always been hard for me to figure out what I want to do when I grow up because I am interested in so many things.

I'm an ENFJ. I have a Bachelor's degree in electrical engineering, and a Master of Music degree in organ and church music (no, I do not have a Bachelor of Music degree). I'm an instrument rated private pilot (but I can't do that right now due to a medical condition), former motorcyclist (my wife won't let me ride - that was when I was single and in California), beginning cellist, church musician, and closet theologian.

I was a full-time church musician for 5 years. I loved that because I got to work with a lot of different people, and even on bad days, there was a sense of purpose. At the same time, I wear my heart on my sleeve, and probably took things too personally (although the parish was highly dysfunctional).

Now I'm back in electrical engineering, and at least it's the kind of EE work I like, but not enough people contact. I also don't feel the sense of purpose I would like out of a job. I miss truly making a difference. (I'm a part-time organist at a church that really needs a musician.)

I'm trying to discern where God is calling me in my life, and I'm doing a lot of reading, talking, and spiritual direction. By the way, my wife is also an ENFJ and a children's librarian (that's her vocation - she loves it!). One of these days, I'll figure out what I want to do when I grow up! (...and I'll be 40 this year.)

As I have been moving my way through these conferences, something that kept coming to my mind was the relationship between our psychological type and the charisms we have been given.

One of the programs the Catherine of Siena Institute in Colorado Springs offers is the Called and Gifted Institute. I have participated in the institute and am a trained interviewer.

I have just been pondering the relationship and correlation of a couple of charisms I believe I have been gifted with and my type. I suppose it is kind of like the chicken and the egg question: I certainly believe my personality type is a gift from God, but which came first? Was my personality a part of my uniquely gifted essence and the charisms were a manifestation of that, or did the charisms (derived from baptism and confirmation) help shape my personality type? Or, is there another way of looking at these?

I'll be dealing with the relationship between charism and natural aptitudes in one of the conferences in the discernment group, which I know you're registered for. The short answer here is that there is generally a relationship between the two, which would go along with the traditional understanding of grace building on nature.