Maybe I just have a case of seasonal affective disorder, but I feel caught in a gloomy disposition.

I had the experience during and after Mass the other day of feeling so aware of the needs of the members of the congregation. I just found myself caught up in / attracted to watching (seeing) so many of those there, their moods/emotional affect, as they prayed...

Perhaps I am too sensitive/open, and need to get more to my life than just spirituality (still working on that) but I was touched by all of this.

Later in the day, I drove to my attorney's office and on the way, all I could think of was Mother Mary and the reports of the miracles of her weeping statues. I began weeping, drawing all sorts of conclusions, "She weeps because of _______ and ________." And I began creating a list inside of me, as the tears fell from my eyes.

Maybe I am praying too much rosary, getting too identified with Mother Mary.

Right now, I just feel weighted down by the morosity of suffering.

My own life has knowns its share and I suspect this is what makes me more open to that seen in others.

Having a night job is not helping, and I am going to make it a priority (without pushing) to create a new resume and begin searching for new (day time) work. I know the economy is tough and there is competition, but I trust the right thing will present itself.

My analyst and I today discussed the idea of finding a way for me to "give" from the sensitivity of my soul. I need to find the way to focus and direct the caring nature of my spirit.

Kristi

Oh Hi Kristi,

I didn't realize that you posted here as it was 'hidden' by the other thead.

Yes, I believe the lack of sunshine does get us more down than we might otherwise be! In fact, just thinking about it being Spring out there makes me brighten up a notch. One piece of research I just read showed that glancing through photos of loved ones is more effective in picking up one's mood than TV, chocolates, and some other miscellaneous methods.

Seriously, I'm sorry to hear of your being "weighted down by the morosity of suffering." It does sound like you're still very open to others' energies, which is not your job, I don't think.

Being active in a creative way might be a good anecdote to the passivity/openness problem (assuming it is a problem for you). Do you have any hobbies or creative outlets that you enjoy? Maybe this is related to your analyst's comment about giving.

The other thing people forget to do which is very beneficial for the brain/body and spirit: exercise!

In any case, let me say a prayer for you, Kristi.

Father God, I pray that Your Word would go forth and touch Kristi's beautiful heart of compassion. I pray that You would protect her from the pain and suffering of this world that is not in Your will for her to endure. Strengthen Kristi to the core, Holy Spirit. Come Holy Spirit. Hold her and keep her from harm. Direct her to paths of creativity that will deeply nourish her spirit and soul. We ask this in the Name of Jesus, our Lord.

Ah, Shasha! Your words have picked me up... and your prayer brought tears to my eyes. Thank you. I was in fact looking at pictures last night...and that did help. You are right, everyone else is not my job, and yet I have this incredible openness/sensitivity and I pray God help me learn to manage it.

Kristi

Good morning, folks!

How many of you are snow-bound in this lovely blizzard? Gives me some time to catch up at SP.

Kristi,

On the other thread, you mentioned Praying the Rosary for Inner Healing by Fr. Dwight Longenecker.

http://www.catholic.org/hf/faith/story.php?id=34515

Here's a clip from the author:

For example, if we have experienced a difficult childhood, when we pray the fourth joyful mystery of Jesus being presented in the temple we offer our childhood to be taken up into his and for his perfect childhood to heal and complete what was lacking in our own.

...sounds very beautiful. Only God can do this kind of healing...if He wants that for us...

I was wondering how the midwesteners here were doing. I have some ice on top of a bit of leftover snow, and a couple of trees have lost their crowns, but otherwise it isn't too bad. I can here loud CRUNCH CRUNCH sounds from the horses breaking through the crust as they walk around to eat their hay outside, which sounds funny.

Hope everyone's okay...

Hi Shasha,

quote:

...sounds very beautiful. Only God can do this kind of healing...if He wants that for us...

How could He not want this for me (anyone)?

You know, I think it is only a matter of "receiving." Really believing it in order to fully receive it. I am practicing. Really practicing.

Responding to this brings tears, and tells me that I also need to "give it" to Him, release it, "offer" it to Him, as Fr. Longenecker says.

Kristi

quote:

I was wondering how the midwesteners here were doing.

My (almost) knee-high, rubber boots were full of snow coming home from work this morning!

Kristi

Kristi, you have my prayers to find a daytime job, if it seems like it would help. I've been struggling with some off/on dpression from other people's suffering...but I was able to move my workspace into a sunroom-type building in early fall, and that light and sense of being outdoors even while in a building has made a big, big, difference for me. Not too spiritual-sounding, I know, to ascribe so much difference to something material, but my mild off/on depression would probably be much worse without that cheery workspace. I thank God for it every day.

quote:

Originally posted by KristiMarie:
Hi Shasha,

quote:

...sounds very beautiful. Only God can do this kind of healing...if He wants that for us...

How could He not want this for me (anyone)?

I meant to say that the Lord may choose inner healing through the Rosary as one way to heal us...He certainly wants us to be healed, but in what way and at what pace is variable. As you know, so we do our part to position ourselves to receive, staying in relationship with God through our "giving" or "offering" to Him our pain.

quote:

Originally posted by Ariel Jaffe:
...I was able to move my workspace into a sunroom-type building in early fall, and that light and sense of being outdoors even while in a building has made a big, big, difference for me. Not too spiritual-sounding, I know, to ascribe so much difference to something material, but my mild off/on depression would probably be much worse without that cheery workspace. I thank God for it every day.

Me too, Ariel. I moved my office recently to one that has a window (from my old place without a window). And I too literally experience gratitude each day I walk in. Gratitude is such a good anti-depressant, isn't it?

Even the snow and being shut in brings special gifts if we can see them...

quote:

Originally posted by Ariel Jaffe:
I was wondering how the midwesteners here were doing. I have some ice on top of a bit of leftover snow, and a couple of trees have lost their crowns, but otherwise it isn't too bad. I can here loud CRUNCH CRUNCH sounds from the horses breaking through the crust as they walk around to eat their hay outside, which sounds funny.

Hope everyone's okay...

I am in Ohio and we missed the brunt of the storm, but like you, we have a lot of ice.. with crunching and cracking..and high winds. One of our trees is down this morning. But we still have our electricity, unlike many.

its is very cold in Montana... yesterday i woke up and it was -20 below with a wind factor of -40.. today it is -18 wind factor -35.. i had things to do today in town but i think i will not be going out today.. beautiful here.. looking out at the fog coming off of the Yellowstone rover.. but .. to cold to go out.. at least until later today...

i have not seen my eagle flying around looking for food the past couple days.. i usually see him at least twice a day.. to cold..

pray for the little animals and birds who are in the middle of this cold front that is affecting the nation....also the homeless...

Good to hear all the weather reports.

The roads were well plowed here in the KC area by the time I came to work this evening (err, yesterday, now). There was "so much" fresh snow Tuesday evening that some folks took their snowmobiles out and around town. I suspect they knew most of the police officers were grounded, except for "real" emergencies. For me, the worst part of the snowfall is that my RCIA class was cancelled. I was looking forward to attending. "Little bit of snow" would not have stopped the soldier in me from going!

Ariel, a day time job WILL be good. As an emergency dispatcher, I work in a rather "private" area. Most all security control centers are rather secluded not only from the outside world, but also from the rest of the interior world within various organizations. No windows to move to in my work situation. Add to this the fact that I sleep during the day time hours = I get much less sunlight exposure than most folks. I am actually thinking of purchasing/trying one of those therapy lights. Along with other things I can do, it may help. But here is one light that does shine at my work station: a little laminated picture of Jesus that I pull out of my purse and set before me. I think the outdoors, or even a view of it, makes a world of difference in a person's life (esp. when one takes the time to appreciate it ... thinking here for a moment of some persons who don't have the opportunity to even look outside regularly ... those, say, bedridden in various confinements; and those in various forms of incarceration).

Thanks for the clarification, Shasha. And yet, my response was true for me. I think (sometimes) what speaks to us is exactly what needs to.

And, here we go, some honesty regarding some of what has been arising for me in my rosary prayers and more of that during the last couple times I attended mass. While I know this has roots also in my childhood experience, I found myself (for a short period) having a hard time praying to an "almighty" Father God, as in the Aposltes' and Nicene Creed. This was not at first a problem and I found that very nice and healing feeling for me...and do, again, now. Given my early life history of sexual abuse, my readers may imagine how significant an area of wounding this (and the sense of the repressed feminine) has been for me. What happened is that I found myself bothered by the fact that we do a whole lot of praying to Father God during mass and then, at the end, turn to a 3 foot tall staute of Mother Mary and say one little Hail Mary. This absence (or so little) of spoken or demonstrative reverenace for the feminine face of God during mass bothered me, reflecting the wound in my own feminine nature. I'm searching and scanning the forum for discussion on this topic, and have read some already, which has been helpful. I welcome any who may feel moved to chime in or point me to more discussion on this. I've lot's of learning to do!

"Brrrrrrrr..." Christina, we've been cold, but that's a "RrrrrrealL" cold child factor!

Kristi, what you share about difficulty praying to a "Father" God makes sense, especially given your family history. People with healthy families and no history of abuse often have the same struggle as well, as it just seems too imbalanced. Of course, at a theological level, none of this has anything to do with gender, but it's the same word we use to connote gender, so the associations can't be helped. Would that there was some kind of non-gender word in the English language to connote individuality!

- - -

Our weather in Wichita was much like what Kristie described for KC -- very cold, windy, and we did have about 5" snow. The brunt of the storm was just to the east of us, where parts of SE KS got up to 18" snow. I was out in it on Tues. a couple of times, shoveling snow and keeping my bird-feeders going. Today, things were better, with sunny skies, less wind, and temps up into the 20s. More snow coming early next week, however, but no, nothing like what Christine described for MT.

quote:

Would that there was some kind of non-gender word in the English language to connote individuality!

It is amazing (and sad, in the world) how gender identification divides us (individually and collectively) - the psychological and emotional wounding it creates/perpetuates.

And, "Christine," my apology for having written your name as Christina.

Kristi

At work last night, I was reading Phil's, "God, Self and Ego." From page 27:

"The moral and spiritual implications of these reflections are many, the most important being the goodness of the individual and his or her developmental journey. It is good to be an Ego-consciousness, desiring to be, to grow, to develop our giftedness, and to share this with others. To the extent that we can do this in openness to God, social relationships, unity with the cosmos, and holistic living, we shall find our Ego experience most rich and meaningful. The problem, of course, is that this context for Ego-development has been lost, and, with it, the fullness of a healthy egoic life."

Tears streamed from my eyes as I read this.

He goes on the speak of how "...many writers on the spiritual life have concluded that the Ego itself is the cause of this disharmony." And then, "As we shall see, however, this view is unwarranted." More tears came.

I really "get" all he is sharing, I really "feel" it.

Thank you for having written this book/paper, Phil. It is saying in short and concise (clear) order some things I needed to have packaged the way it is.

Even with the time I have spent in analysis, I was not getting some of the things that feel to be coming to me in a deep way right now.

Shasha, where you wrote: "Only God can do this kind of healing...if He wants that for us..." And I answered with what I did, it was because I was/am feeling that God wants to bring me to deeper healing, hence my tears even as I wrote then.

I can't tell you all how hungry I am, to know Christ in a deeper and more intimate way.

Kristi

You're quite welcome, Kristi. I'm glad to hear that little book is making a difference in your life.

As I mentioned early on in the book, I struggled for years with the meaning of God, Self and, especially, Ego, and not just in an academic sense. There were many implications for spiritual practice and inner healing, especially concerning what I call Ego in the book. I'm still very much OK with the perspective I expressed, there, and maybe I'll even get around to doing a re-write of that book one day. Kudos to you for reading through all that!

I don't understand.
Our openness to God is through our spirit, not on something that deals with the flesh.
In fairness, I have not read your book, however it still seems contrary to a contemplative life.

Jeff

Hi Jeff, and welcome to the forum.

I'm assuming you're commenting on Kristi's quote from my book about the importance of the Ego being open to God. I think you'd need to read the book to understand what I mean by Ego. It's not a fallen instrument of the flesh or evil, as is often written; that would be Ego contaminated by false self conditioning. Rather, I speak of the Ego as the conscious agent of our human consciousness, which is indeed spiritual.

- see https://shalomplace.org/eve/for.../18910625/m/10910695 among several other threads of relevance.

Some parts are a slower read than others, Phil, but it truly is immeasurably helpful, most especially the part on ego. The last time I was seeing and feeling this the way I am now (in regards to ego, in regards to how we hurt ourselves by badgering the very vehicle [- through thought that tells us we are supposed to get rid of or go beyond ego, which potentially only creates more false selves] that God gives us with which to experience Him and all of life) was when reading one of Clarissa Estes' (Jungian) tales. I believe it was from her, Creative Fire. She too talks about that "ember" (that remnant with which to do battle with our false selves/fallen nature) that can't be put out... Don't recall exactly this moment if that is the same word (ember) you used. But she tells the story (myth/tale) about a King that mortally wounds his dog (ego, in the story) who was only trying to protect his (inner, divine?) child (that potential). For me, it illustrated how the false selves (at least some of them) may merely be trying to protect that potential life ... how, really, ego should be the loyal servant of the Self. I wish I'd continued with this line of contemplation then, instead of other "spiritual" seeking.

Excuse my rather disjointed paragraph!

Jeff, if you are referring to the book as something of the flesh, have you never felt a contemplative nature when reading? Ever been "inspired" (in-spirited) by, say, a piece of poetry, or other work?

Kristi

Hi all,

Phil,I understand what you mean and I see the difference, however I believe our understanding of our spiritual realization is not interpreted by our five senses nor through any rationalization but through an inner "sense" that is not cognizant by any of our other senses and to a certain degree not tangible to even our mind.
It is a wonderful part of our faith that is aware of the unseen or of that which is spiritual. To me it's beyond any of our earthly senses of recognition but only by our soul. I can see where this might be this "ego" you refer to. In any case, I must get a copy of your book, so I can read about it in context.
Kristi, I apologize for being so vague in my reply, but I did not mean for it to be interpreted that way. One of my resolutions for the past 10 years is to read more of the numerous books I have allowed to collect dust on the shelves. (and I still keep collecting them) Yes, I have felt that inner comfort and joy when reading something inspirational. In fact, while attending a contemplative retreat here in Las Cruces, NM last week I started reading such a book obtained from their library. I highly recommend it.
It's called "The Monastic Journey" by Thomas Merton. It is a beautiful description of the mental mindset and of our presence in Jesus Christ required when living the monastic lifestyle.
Pure Joy...

Jeff

quote:

I believe our understanding of our spiritual realization is not interpreted by our five senses nor through any rationalization but through an inner "sense" that is not cognizant by any of our other senses and to a certain degree not tangible to even our mind.

Jeff, I have no disagreement with that. My only comment about Ego and God above (quoted by Kristi) is that the Ego needs to be "open to God."

Maybe check out the discussion of Ego and Self that I linked to above, as it goes far beyond what my little book discusses. Basically, Self is the "I" or subjective consciousness of the soul and it encompasses all of the various activities of consciousness. Ego is not something separate from Self or Soul (which is a more philosophical concept) but is the conscious, intentional aspect of Self. I know some people write about it differently, as more of a false self, and, to be sure, Ego can be corrupted by false self conditioning. But just as a skin disease does not make the body bad, neither does our false self conditioning make the Ego a bad thing. It is essentially good, and it is also essentially spiritual in nature, though it has a psychological dimension as well.

Phil,

I can see the basis for this but it is so contrary to what I have read (Bible included), heard and what I personally believe. I can see where it is inherently good and seeks spiritual knowledge and peace, but what is the justification for this not being self centered and not on God and Christ.
Again I have said this without reading the discussion you referred to, which I will do so now.

P.S. I love your daily e-mail, which is a great blessing to my life. Thank you for your wonderful quotes and insight.

Jeff

Jeff, and others,

we'll probably all agree that "the spirit", meaning the highest dimension of human nature, is the place where we meet God and touch him - mystical writers refer to it as the "spark", "the inner citadel", "the peak of mind", "the center" etc.etc. It expresses itself in intellect and will, but some suggest that in its nature it's higher than those faculties and unifies them.

On the other, hand, what Phil and Kristi seem to emphasize, as I see it, is the "incarnate" aspect of Christian spirituality. Incarnation, Resurrection and Ascension are supernatural phenomena that make all human being (and all creation) sacred, graced and open to God. That's why we can touch God in Christ not only through our "spiritual" activity, but also through eating, drinking, cleaning up the house, resting, through senses, emotions and so on. We touch him by our spirit, not by our senses - it must be clear - but the place of touching can be anything, as long as we're in the state of sanctifying grace (it seems to me).

Phil and I had a short discussion in the Incarnation topic, around Christmas time, about how divine and human, spirit and matter, are united and even "mixed" (experientially, not ontologically) in Jesus Christ, and hence - in all of us and in the whole universe. For me this is the spiritual meaning of the "finality" of the revelation in Jesus Christ. It's not only what he said, it's what HE IS - that's God's message to us.

And, Kristi, I totally relate to your tears! I pray for you, that the Lord heal you on still deeper levels. As I understand your story, for you it means also deep appreciation of the body, the senses, emotions. I recall St. Bernard's 4th degree of love: To love oneself for God. The third - to love God for God, you seem to have been already given. The further step is to come down, with love and acceptance, to your own self, body, psyche and spirit.

quote:

And, Kristi, I totally relate to your tears! I pray for you, that the Lord heal you on still deeper levels. As I understand your story, for you it means also deep appreciation of the body, the senses, emotions. I recall St. Bernard's 4th degree of love: To love oneself for God. The third - to love God for God, you seem to have been already given. The further step is to come down, with love and acceptance, to your own self, body, psyche and spirit.

Hi Mt,

Oh, I was sure I was not the only one who has cried such tears, of longing to personally love one's self (as God loves us) into healing. In this very moment of writing, I am seeing it actually as His love, that I am not separate from, not different from. We spend so much time, as learned, sort of going out of body, as we are taught (or take in, the misinterpretations) that me and my body is not good. Hence, we strive for that which we believe is somewhere outside of us, above us. And, now, my thoughts turn to my seeing how it is that I have given up my self through life, in a very real sense. And I just want Jesus' Holy Spirit to fill me now, lead me, guide me, make me whole. I just finished my scripture reading and felt like warm water was washing over ("in" and "through") me...Him. Yes, Mt, love for my own self...all of me and what I have ever been/done...body, psyche and spirit.

Kristi