From Daily Seed October 22
Is it possible for a person to be a follower of Jesus and be wealthy? Why? Why not?

This is something I think about frequently. I look around at my life and I wonder what I have done to deserve a nice home, nice clothes, an intellectually stimulating job, etc. My neighbors have a swimming pool, and while I certainly would never judge them (they are good people, very supportive of me, and I don't know what I would do without them) but I don't think that I could ever have a swimming pool and be comfortable with it. Does that make any sense? Perhaps it is too public of a display of wealth? Or maybe I would be too concerned with how it would look to others? But deep down, I don't think I deserve to have it QUITE that good.
On the other hand, I'm not bothered that I have a nice wardrobe, or that I can afford to buy nice things for my children. Can I ever really justify having it "this good?"
Can any of us ever justify having MORE than we really need?

A few years ago our parish raised money to make improvements on various buildings in the parish. Our pastor put in a state of the ark kitchen in the rectory, and redid the parish dining room with some kind of fancy woodwork (waiscotting I think it was called?). He took a lot of heat for this. After all, did he really deserve (or need) to have it that nice?

Obviously he thought he (or future priests)
did deserve it. But that only confuses me more. And don't get me wrong....I'm not judging him any more than I'm judging my neighbors with the pool. I just really can't seem to find any answers for this whole business of having (and wanting) more than we need.

Anne (quite comfortable in Missouri)

I just really can't seem to find any answers for this whole business of having (and wanting) more than we need.

Anne, this is a big issue, for sure. How much is enough? It's a question worth struggling with.

One thing needs to be noted first, and that's that poverty is no guarantee of virtue, nor wealth of vice. Some of Jesus' closest friends were wealthy, and he seemed to not condemn them for it. His greater concern was about how one's possessions affected one at the level of the heart. Does one's wealth make one more selfish, possessive, defensive, etc.? If so, then that is a problem. If not, then wealth might be given to some that they might disperse it wisely. We do need people like this.

Let's hear from others on this. How much is enough? Too much?

Phil

Well, I think it's proper to reflect on how much is too much. Certainly we live in a culture where acquiring "stuff" is a way of life - almost to the point of addiction.

I think it's best first to dispel a crucial myth; that having an abundance yourself means that someone else has less because of it. In fact in this free-market economy buying stuff can actually help someone down the line make a living and provide for their family - either here or in some far-off country. If you buy that swimming pool, Anne, you're helping some swimming pool maker stay in business.

Of course I think I know what you really mean: are we putting ourselves in danger of becoming materialistic and shallow by acquiring things for the sake of acquiring? Are we mindlessly using possessions to try and fill some hole that possessions can't possibly fill?

I think we're all in danger of that and I'll bet you that all of us do that more than we think. The more we acquire the less we appreciate what we have until it all becomes a big blur of things. The more we possess the more these possesions possess us. Each of our possessions is one more thing to maintain, one more thing to protect, one more thing we could lose.

Sometimes the only thing to do is to grab a free book at the library and enjoy some cheap (but enriching) entertainment to gain perspective. Or read my post, of course.

Hi Brad,

Well, first of all, I would never have a swimming pool....but that's because I'm much too lazy to maintain one.

I've read a bunch of books which talk about our "desires" and how we do and buy all sorts of things in order to fulfill these desires. I think that's what you were talking about also. In fact, I heard a talk about this just this morning. The speaker said that God Himself is the one who places those desires within us, and that our deepest desire is really for Him....even though we don't always recognize it. And then we run around doing all sorts of things trying to fulfill these desires. This, according to the speaker is what determines our spirituality. The speaker also talked about balance, and that we run into trouble when our desires take over and our lives don't have balance. Then we find ourselves struggling with addictions and obsessions.

Another issue for me is guilt. I sometimes feel guilty for having it so nice. Any ideas for how to deal with that?

Also, Phil, the speaker today spoke of Ron
Rolheiser's books, and on the break he and I talked about Rolheiser and Gerald May's books. This was the first individual that I've encountered who had heard of either authors, except you, of course. I also told him I had found a spiritual director via the internet. He was quite surprised and interested and I explained how it had all come to be.

Anne

Anne, that's a great question. Guilt is a great motivator (if not a particularly healthy one if in large doses). Guilt is supposed to tell us when we're off kilter in our actions - if we only know how to listen. I'm not a particularly good listener myself.

In my experience guilt is usually associated with living up to other people's expectations or at least avoiding their criticisms. I'd start by asking myself who might be displeased with the way you're living.

We can all drive ourselves crazy by trying to get rid of all these little unpleasant things in our lives - like guilt. The only real cure is to put something positive into our life. Consider guilt to be your friendly motivator to do something good for yourself, your family or a neighbor. Let's not give guilt any more power than it deserves. We all have it and, like a Chinese finger puzzle, the more we struggle and pull the tighter it binds us.

I think we'd all do better to think not about living guilt-free, pain-free, sorrow-free and such. It's not going to happen. And the more we concern ourselves with eradicating some of these things, and the more attention we give them, the more power we give them to control us.

Now - if only I could take my own advice.

"The more we possess the more these possesions possess us. Each of our possessions is one more thing to maintain, one more thing to protect, one more thing we could lose."

Hi all... just back from a wonderful time of retreat and so interested in catching up on all of your thoughts and ideas.

Ann.. this one sentence grabbed me. I think you have summed up the problem rather well here. It is not what we possess but what possesses us that is important and I think this can go far beyond the material things we accumulate. Many would be willing to give up the swimming pool but not their "place" in the church... or their position in society.. or their friends and families for God.... me included here probably. Although I would like to think I would, if push came to shove - .
The thing is we do what we can and try to keep our eyes on the pearl rather than the oyster.

As for guilt, I agree it is probably something we all struggle with. Perhaps it comes from our desire for perfection - and our inability to attain anything close. While we can accept the forgiveness of God and of others - forgiving ourselves can be so much harder.

"In my experience guilt is usually associated with living up to other people's expectations or at least avoiding their criticisms. I'd
start by asking myself who might be displeased with the way you're living. "

Brad... a really great book that addresses this is Maggie Ross's the Fountain and the Furnace. It's out of print but well worth the search for a copy. Anyhow, I think that when we try to live out the expectations and desires of others, we allow them to recreate us - to make us who they want or need us to be rather than who we are/were created to be and so we are in constant struggle with ourselves. We can loose ourselves in trying to be who others think we should be. Rather than growing into ourselves we try to grow into someone else to please others.

Who/what are our gods? Now.. that makes me feel guilty but then I try to remember that I am only human... "Christ have mercy upon me a sinner"! But God loves us anyhow! Incredible!

Thanks, Wanda. I'll see if I can find a copy of that book. You're so right. It's MUCH tougher to forgive ourselves. Often all we have left to do is to punt (that is, to pray). We face a lot of fourth downs in life.

I see the next topic starter coming: sports analogies and the meaning of life.

Hey! I came across this in my reading this evening. This is from a book called "Touching the Holy" by Robert J. Wicks.

"In keeping with the following excerpt from Jewish spiritual wisdom, spiritual guides first encourage us to fully enjoy our family, friends, success, food, money, health--all the gifts of God.

The Jerusalem Talmud states that when, after life, one will confront ultimate judgement, one of the issues on the table will be whether one denied oneself the experience of those enjoyments that God made available, and if so, why? God does not play games, making enjoyable pleasures available, but then saying you cannot touch them, you cannot enjoy them. On the contrary, by denying, one misses the experience of God's majesty.

However, they also subsequently point out that when we have become so attached to these gifts that we are no longer disciplined in their use and feel we cannot be happy without them, then we are not free anymore. There is something wrong.

The question we are asked to grapple with today is: Are we both truly grateful for the people and things God has given us to enjoy in our lives, but also willing to let go of them rather than to try to hold onto, control, or idolize them?"

Boy...that was really helpful for me. (Was it helpful for any of you??)

Anne