Happy Easter, dear forum friends. And congratulations to Jacques and Paul who have made the journey into the Catholic community of faith. I hope you find many blessings here.
I will share a couple of quotes from Jim Arraj's book, The Bodily Resurrection of Jesus, hoping that anyone who reads this will feel edified. The book is online, or you can order a paperback or kindle version. We can also discuss the resurrection more if you'd like.
Spiraling, spiraling, spiraling…….
This I got today (Easter) from KW’s website. (Having once purchased a teaching that was jointly done by Fr. Keating and Ken Wilber I receive e-bulletins from KW’s Integral Life Website.)
This was from today’s bulletin – their Easter message and take on the Resurrection.
“What does the belief that Jesus rose again from the dead mean to an integrally-informed Christian? We have doubtless given up the traditional belief that Jesus is the world’s only Savior. We have also likely rejected the conventional theology that the resurrection of Jesus “proves” that he was the one and only Son of God. And we have probably discarded the idea that Jesus’ corpse was resuscitated and brought back to life.
What do reasonable, integrally-informed people today on a spiritual path do with the resurrection of Jesus? Let’s explore.”
What’s that old saying….out of the mouths of serpents?
This is what I hate about a lot of the yellow-meme clan (I don’t say all – since Phil does not fit this bill; though I do not know any besides Phil who consider they are yellow-memesters and would not agree with what is shown above).
This isn’t worldview or modern perspective it is heresy – a politically unattractive though quite correct word even in the third millennium.
And they believe they are Christians…….?????? Aiyee! says me.
PEACE FLAG (Rays of the Rising Son)!
That's very creative and cool, Stephen.
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Pop, the Spiral is more about worldviews than content. Wilber has an Easternish faith perspective that is a priori to his worldview. Mine is Christian faith. Faith is not reducible to any particular worldview, although worldviews influence how we understand and express our faith.
Don't you just love how the Wilberites put things -- as though "everyone knows" or "no one with any sense believes any more that . . . " They should read Jim Arraj's book. Incidentally, I think Jim and Tyra Arraj are a good example of not only Yellow, but a Yellow/Turquoise lifestyle.
Percent of Americans Believing in the Resurrection Drops To 64% From 77% Last Easter
I checked out the questions. Same wording. Of course, the sample could be significantly different, but Rasmussen usually gets that right.
What's going on, here?
i could not help but notice yesterday that Google had as their front cover Easter morning, a picture of Hugo Chávez , not a thing about it being Easter.. nothing.. but then, this has gone on for years.
Then i went to CNN news and the front page news of the morning was how Christian martyrdom may have well been exaggerated throughout the centuries...
below is a bit of the article....
" The debate over exactly how many Christians were persecuted and martyred may seem irrelevant centuries later. A scholarly consensus has indeed emerged that Roman persecution of Christians was sporadic, and that at least some Christian martyrdom stories are theological tall tales.
But a new book by Candida Moss, a New Testament professor at the University of Notre Dame, is bringing that message to the masses.
Do Christians have a martyr complex today?
Moss says ancient stories of church persecution have created a contemporary cult of bogus Christian martyrs. She says too many American Christians are acting like they’re members of a persecuted minority, being thrown to the lions by people who simply disagree with them....Professor Candida Moss, author of "The Myth of Persecution," says most stories of Christian martyrs were fabricated."
More and more secular society seems to try and discredit the Gospel message and Christians today..
The past few months i have read about a 'mom ' who is out evangelizing other mother's to raise their children 'without God'.
I also read about another man, Todd Stiefel, an ex catholic who is considered to be the front man behind the nation’s fastest-growing “religious” group: the nonbelievers. With great zeal he is out to lure any christian who is in doubt away from their faith... spending huge sums of money on atheist advertizements and rallies to promote atheism...
you cam read about him here...
Personally i find this troublesome . actually. to be 100% frank.. it makes me sick of heart. It has monopolized my thoughts and thus prayers for months., that being the seeming rise of the nonbeliever.. whether that be blatant humanism or the more veiled , but equally lethal, new age thinking which is also on the rise... it is all the same, atheism.
In sharp contrast we have Pope Francis washing the feet of a prisoner...
Shows like 'The Bible' are the most highest ranked TV shows going this spring....many people seem to be sincerely hungry for God...
Being one who follows the Apparitions of the Blessed Mother in Medjugorje, 2012 was the 2nd biggest year in the past 31 years for pilgrims visiting the area.
what is going on? Only God knows.. but the divide between the secular and genuine interest in the Gospel message seems to grow wider each passing year.....
increased disinterest in the Lord, with emphasis on ' self development 'at the expense of needing a Savior and increased indifference and hatred toward His church...
this may sound radical.. but in my heart i do not see it as radical at all....
the trends these days saddens my heart and causes me great concern.. the Lords mercy is great, but how long will God tolerate the apathy and mockery of His Word on this earth ?
Yes Christine, from the University of Notre Dame -- the University of Our Lady -- a New Testament professor with the scoop to dupe! Aiyee!
And young Christians go there believing it to be a source of knowledge in the Christian tradition.
Well they lauded Obama despite the protests of the magisterium so I guess we can expect only continued betrayals and scorn
The charisms are for the builing UP of the body of Christ NT scripture tells us. This NT professor's ability to diminish the body of Christ is not the expressing of knowledge nor of love. Alas! But CNN and the spirit of the world now laud her evidently. Devil, he laugh and slap his thigh. A house divided against itself. He laugh.
BUT HAPPY EASTER SEASON TO YOU-- AND ALL!
p.s. Isn't candida some type of infection?
Pop, I checked out the article from Integral Life that you referenced above and it can be found at the link below:
Turns out it was written by a Christian minister who apparently writes for Integral Life and has familiarity with Wilber's system. It seems he does take the resurrection seriously but not the resurrection of the body. For him, it was about Jesus manifesting on a subtle plane and the witnesses seeing and experiencing him on that level. Of course, as you noted, his universalist theology was also on full display from the first paragraph on.
Jim Arraj's book that I linked to in my opening post addresses this tendency to view the resurrection as just another mystical experience, or hallucination of some kind. He reviews several authors who've tried to make this case, and shows the inadequacy of their hypotheses. None of them seem to take the account of the empty tomb seriously, though the corpse of Jesus would have constituted a strong rebuttal of the early Church's resurrection message. I think we can be reasonably sure that no such corpse was ever produced -- hence the stories about the Apostles stealing the body. Where Jim comes out is in affirming a distinction between an appearance and a mystical experience. Appearances happen unbidden to people in a normal state of consciousness, as with most of the Marian apparitions. Visions usually come in the context of mystical prayer, where the mind/brain is already disposed to receive extraordinary manifestations. Big difference!
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Christine, I saw that google doodle of Chavez and thought it an odd thing to do on Easter Sunday. At least he was a Christian and a "walk-the-talk" one, at that. Also, it was Chavez's birthday. Still . . .
I think we are moving more and more into a post-Christian culture and should not be too surprised to find subtle and/or overt dissing of Christianity going on. Paradoxically, this will help to strengthen the Church, as one will have to really make a decision and commitment for Christ to hang in there.
(I had the letter below posted in a separate thread as an open letter to Rev. Paul Smith. He hasn't replied to my email with it nor my invitation to come and dialogue online, so I assume I am being "duly ignored" )
- concerning his article from Integral Life on the resurrection of Jesus.
- see http://integrallife.com/integr...t-about-resurrection
(comments welcomed even if Rev. Smith does not reply)
Dear Rev. Smith,
A friend pointed me to your article in "Integral Life," which I read with interest and some disagreement. I did not see a way to post a comment on the blog so I thought I'd contact you directly. This letter is also posted as an "open letter" to you on my discussion forum.
I am also a writer on Christian spirituality and theology, with 20 books in print, one of them on the Resurrection of Jesus. I also work at a Catholic retreat center in Great Bend, KS.
Mostly, where I think you go wrong in the article is in trying to explain the experiences of the witnesses in terms of manifestation on a subtle level. There is a distinction to be made between an "appearance," which comes unbidden to people in an ordinary state of consciousness, and a "vision" which often comes in the context of a mystical state of consciousness. The reports of the resurrection witnesses are more of appearances than mystical visions. Even in the case of Paul, who experienced the ascended Christ, he was not in a mystical state, though the appearance was less "physical" than with the other apostles.
There are other problems with your article:
1. Christians do not say "that Jesus' corpse was resuscitated and brought back to life." We say that he was resurrected, which is to say that his body was radically transformed in the Spirit. You as a minister ought to know the difference between physical resuscitation (as in the raising of Lazarus) and resurrection.
2. You ignore the empty tomb. Surely the corpse of Jesus would have constituted a definitive rebuttal of the early Church's resurrection witness. So, then . . . where was the corpse of Jesus? (and please don't say that doesn't matter; it does).
3. You deny that Jesus is "the world's only Saviour." On what grounds? How does being "integrally-informed" as you claim to be warrant such a denial? I mean, you know this for sure?
4. You also seem to deny that the resurrection "proves" that Jesus is the only Son of God. And your denial proves that he was not?
5. You cite the example of a "well-educated Christian friend in India" who asked Jesus if she could give her heart to Krishna, and Jesus said "of course." Surely you know this is the stuff of private revelation with no doctrinal implications? You go on to note: "Whatever the meaningful deity forms that may come to us in our I-Thou relationship with the Sacred Mystery, they are embraced in integrally-informed spiritual devotion."
It seems in all of this that "integrally-informed" has become, for you, the most important criterion shaping your theological perspective and spiritual practice, moreso than even the Church's traditional affirmations about who Jesus is and what we profess concerning his resurrection, our foundational belief. That is sad!
I refer you to Jim Arraj's fine work, The Bodily Resurrection of Jesus, wherein he examines alternative explanations of the resurrection like trances, mystical states and the like. There's also some fine theology you might appreciate.
- see http://www.innerexplorations.c...omor/resurrecion.htm
Also, I have posted this letter on my forum as an "open letter" to you, inviting you to come and dialogue about it if you'd like. I'm certainly open to correction if I've misread some of what you wrote.
Peace, and Happy Easter!
Phil St. Romain
Moved Reply: 'Mine know Me'. The ONLY Son of God told us that. What could be more succinct? More clear?
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