http://www.innerworkspublishin...news/vol15/goody.htm

My journey has been a long and lonely one. Joined tribe number one for most of my adult life. No wonder I had few freinds. Then I migrated to Bill Bennett and Bush the elder and Max Lucado. Migrating further down the list, this is the first year that I read Marianne Williamson's political writings, and found out who Dennis Kucinich and Jim Wallis are.
Dropping all the way to tribe number 11, I'm into the Dalai Lama and Gandhi, and have enjoyed many black preachers from tribe number 12.

I have found that strong positions tend to generate fear and alienation. I'd like to grow and relate to more of my fellow human beings, which is not to say that I am free to worship public opinion and make people-pleasing my God. Jesus was a radical and woe unto me if all speak well of me.

Which tribe do y'all belong to?

jointhetribe.org

I think they left one out:

Left Coast Loony

Examples: Martin Sheen, Maria Cantwell and probably a couple of these guys.

Percent of the electorate: Knowing that would require math, and they don't generally do math.

Who are they: People who strongly, vibrantly and sincerely believe that all people should, cradle to grave (excepting the time spent in the womb), be denied nothing and it is the duty of government to provide this. Government, from their point of view, is all good, all powerful, and all knowing. But generally speaking they think the idea of God is silly

Ideology: I think this is best summed up by Sheryl Crow "I think war is based in greed and there are huge karmic retributions that will follow. I think war is never the answer to solving any problems. The best way to solve problems is to not have enemies." and Janeane Garofalo "When Communist U.S.S.R. was a superpower, the world was better off. The right-wing media is trying to marginalize the peace movement." and Richard Gere "America has never paid any attention to other people, so it's absurd for Bush to say that it's all in the best interests of the Iraqi people."

Party: Quite often.

What they care about: See above.

What they might like about Bush: This is a family site. I can't go into that.

Political significance: Squeaky wheels who are placated only by the most expensive types of grease.

-----

MM said: I have found that strong positions tend to generate fear and alienation.

I think that if we are to assume the role of wise adults in this world then we ought to moderate our speech somewhat so as not to make offending the main point of our speech, but there is absolutely nothing wrong with strongly held ideas. I think it just depends on the ideas.

Chuckle! Grin, wink, nudge. The Tao. Cause and effect. Evil strengthens the good. Wars create peace movements. Immigration creates response:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minuteman_Project

Columbus bad! Columbus good! One man's Columbus day is another woman's Day of Indiginous Resistance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbus_Day

How about Columbus is about average, good and bad as the rest of us are?

nonduality.com

How about Columbus is about average, good and bad as the rest of us are?

How about not seeing him as a stereotype and looking at him as an individual? Isn't that what the leftists want? Well, not really. It was a trick question. From Wiki:

quote:

Some people, particularly Native Americans, find the holiday offensive because they object to honoring a person who they see as opening the door to European colonization, the exploitation of native peoples and the slave trade�

That pretty much says it all. Why dump all that on Columbus? Why make of him this symbol? Yeah, as if no one else from either continent would have eventually built a boat and discovered that the other existed.

Right now we normal, freedom-loving, non-America-hating Americans are indigenous and we're watching as the leftist Marxists sail into our universities, schools, public airwaves, book stores, and street corners to try to violently take over this country with their distorted version of the truth. And they have the nads to put this all on an Italian explorer.

As I've long thought, the psychology of Marxism/liberalism/leftism is one of cognitive dissonance. It is particularly one where denial and projection play leading roles. Or to put it another way, a skunk smells his own hole.

After 14 years of ugly protests in Denver over the Italian American's Columbus Day Parade, and over 250 arrests last year, we finally had a peacefull protest/parade this time, thanks to six months advance preparation by Denver's finest. Tom Tancredo road at the front. Nice George Will column
today on "the Tank" Tancredo and his grandfather:

http://www.suntimes.com/index/will.html


republican's_sharp_tounge@minuteman)project.org

You guys in Colorado sure have interesting politics.

I'm somewhere in the Convertible Catholic / Moderate Evangelical zone, according to the descriptions made, probably more with the latter, politically.

Shalom Place Prognosticators

Examples: Mystical Michael, Ann Coulter, George Will (but not necessarily in that order)

Percent of the electorate: What is 574 divided by 350 million?

Who are they: Freeloaders who won't get serious and join the pay area of Shalom Place where the real learning takes place. But that only scratches the surface. Generally speaking, they think it right that "Garofalo" rhymes with "buffalo". They are a bastion of Middle American values. They think jars full of urine are meant to be taken to the nurse, not the museum.

Ideology: Although Shalom Place Prognosticators have a decidedly non-multiculturalist, non-America-hating right wing tilt, their views run the gamut thanks to some closet left-wingers. But all agree the Michael Moore is an ass, Barbara Streisand should stick to singing, and Hillary Clinton could quite possibly be the anti-Christ.

Party: A few libs, independents, and moderates (yeah�like there's a big difference), one theocon (he's on sabbatical now�come back to the five and dime, JB), some Reagan Democrats, a few Okies (I think that's an official party�at least in some states), one coultercon, but mostly old-school Democrats who haven't yet given up hope that they can take back their party. (If they ever do they're going to have to give it a good delousing before moving back in.)

What they care about: Rooting out bias wherever they find it. Making fun of atheists. Not killing children as a means of birth control. Over-thinking and over-analyzing any problem under the sun. Did I mention making fun of atheists?

What they might like about Bush: That even we have a chance at becoming a Supreme Court Justice.

Political significance: If you do like they do in the Olympics and throw out the high and the low scores, the amalgamation of opinions here is a very good representation of thoughtful Americans. We're so important we're considering hosting our own presidential debate. Ann Coulter would be the moderator.

High IQ republicans: Brad Nelson and James Woods

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Woods

He has an interesting story about 9/11, the driving
force in politics today. Straight eye for the queer guys on United Airlines flights.

Another high IQ, this time a former Democratic guv
from Colorado, where we do "have some interesting politics."

http://www.snopes.com/politics/soapbox/lamm.asp

How not to destroy America:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radical_middle

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_Miller

If David Hawkins is right, the War on Drugs is below the level of integrity. Milton Friedman agrees:

http://www.druglibrary.org/spe...iedman/socialist.htm

What else is socialist? Health care, which Hawkins calibrates in the 400s prior to the sixties and now below the level of integrity, the military, which is notorious for inefficiency and waste, and Great Society programs which are administered by overcumbered and wasteful agencies.

Corporations are also lagging behind the general public, and some of them will go away, but the point I wish to make over and over and ad nauseum
is that when the level of consciousness rises, political problems take care of themselves and new solutions pop out of thin air.

Conclusion: Spirituality is a higher calling than politics, and to believe otherwise places the cart before the horse.

Yes, I'm having a good day!

if_i_were_emperor.com

Corporations are also lagging behind the general public

It�s strange, MM, that corporations have become so demonized in recent years since they are the very things that provide us with the expectations of a better standard of living and the luxury of leisure time in order to sit back and bitch about them in the first place. Corporations are the very instrument and vehicle for securing for us the kind of riches, security and leisure that most of us enjoy in the west. It is only because of productivity and efficiency that we have these things. Corporations are the natural and normal economic entities to manage this productivity and consolidate the efficiency. Fine, let�s hold corporations to the same standards we hold everyone else to and not let them slip by because the may be able to use their power and influence to circumvent such rules. But to just dump on them mindlessly as the left does is the ultimate in Marxist stupidity. Well, maybe the murder of tens of millions around the world because of Communism is the ultimate stupidity, but I digress.

The orange meme provides a great many benefits to all, and took many centuries to develop, but many are reaching higher than orange, and many have opted out of corporate life. One motor company executive
worth many millions is delivering thousands of wheelchairs to places like India and Africa, so it seems he had found a higher calling.

I know some teachers who are frustrated by the educational system, which operated at a much higher level 40 or 50 years ago than it does today. Some way must be found to make it once again the envy of the world.

The war on drugs, according to David Hawkins, will not be effective until it reaches a level over 300. Why waste so much energy destroying crops and building up the Prison Industrial Complex?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P...n-industrial_complex

Once again, raise the level of consciousness and a solution may be found. Why not work in the hearts and between the ears of the addicts themselves?

The Enneagram helped me to discover how to use the
synthesizing ability of my personality type to combine seemingly contradictory ideas. Applicants for public assistance are currently being taught their Enneagram type. Not that long ago it was an ancient mystery school available only to a select few. Information is power and power is now available to more individuals than ever before.

It seems we live in world built for orange meme managers rather than empowered and informed individuals, but this is rapidly changing!

brave_new_world@higher_consciousness.org

The orange meme provides a great many benefits to all, and took many centuries to develop, but many are reaching higher than orange, and many have opted out of corporate life. One motor company executive
worth many millions is delivering thousands of wheelchairs to places like India and Africa, so it seems he had found a higher calling.

That�s a great thing to do�with wheelchairs that were likely mass-produced by a corporation, and wealth and leisure time to do this in the first place enabled by the corporate system. It�s not an either-or choice, although admittedly I think too few people are bringing a sense of humanity to these ventures. And as much as some people have tried to equate the profit motive with being evil and stingy, that�s just not inherently so. That�s why I keep bringing up the examples of socialism, Marxism and Communism. Forcibly taking away the profit motive is inherently evil.

I think it�s great that people are waking up to a higher calling. I imagine that�s easier to do once the requisite wealth has been amassed. Again, that�s surely fine. Better than nothing. But it�s pretty �bipolar� if you ask me. We�d be better off ratcheting back a little on our breakneck wealth-producing drive and bringing some more humanity to the 9-to-5 grind. Jumping out of that nightmare with a golden parachute isn�t quite the same thing as reforming the system in the first place.

The good news does not always make it to the front page. A corporate type just donated millions to a local college. This kind of thing happens every day!
Noblesse Oblige.

So much human and monetary capital is wasted. We have an overabundance and lack the requisite wisdom, at times, to know what to do with it. Everyone can find a Magnificent Obsession:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0047203

USA Today ran a two page ad with statements by the administration on Saddam's intentions and capabilties, which have not panned out. The ad has pictures of angry officials which cast them in a bad light. I don't subscribe to the notion that they deliberately decieved the American people.

"Bush Lied- Thousands Died", reads the bumper sticker.

These people have devoted their lives to public service. They all have enough money to buy an island somewhere, yet they serve.

noblesse_oblige.org

So much human and monetary capital is wasted. We have an overabundance and lack the requisite wisdom, at times, to know what to do with it. Everyone can find a Magnificent Obsession:

I agree with you wholeheartedly, MM. I�m pretty much a "change the person and the whole world will change" kind of guy. I�ll grant you that the style and philosophy of systems and institutions are absolutely vital, for even good people can�t do much with inherently bad institutions. Conversely, of course, good institutions aren�t nearly as effective without good people running them, but that�s a damn sight better situation than the utopic vision which, somehow or others, always leads to the situation of bad institutions that are in need of being populated by good people in order for it to work even minimally. Of course, we know people aren�t angels so good institutions that take this into account are SO much preferable to bad institutions that require people to be perfect in order for them to work as the philosophy behind them says they should. These latter kinds of institutions, of course, suppose that people are so malleable, and the ideas behind their institution so strong, that they can overcome human nature. Well, you can�if you kill and imprison them. That�s about the only way Communism works or will ever work. Socialism is Communism�s first cousin.

So let�s go ahead and be ambitious. Let�s change people for the better and institutions for the better. But I think only if we keep in mind the limitations of both will we make any headway.

These people have devoted their lives to public service. They all have enough money to buy an island somewhere, yet they serve.

Hey, wasn�t the guy who wrote "Amazing Graze" working on a slave ship at the time? Don�t get me wrong, MM. Much, much experience and wisdom is garnered by those who have gone through a lifetime in the trenches. I guess I�m just a little tired of hearing (especially from the Hollywood types) how little they say money and fame means to them now that they�ve made it to the top. Well, that�s pretty damn easy for them to say once they are financially secure and the world loves them.

I believe I catch your drift, it ain't having what you want, so much as wanting what you have. Envy and greed are two of the seven deadly sins.

I believe that I have located these Marxist folk you
are so very opposed to"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C...l_Progressive_Caucus

I count 58 of them, which means almost 400 are not of this stripe, so, it's not exactly the October revolution. Hawkins calibrates Marxism at 130 and the United States at 421, so, it is highly unlikely that we would drop that far in one or two election cycles. I'm not so worried about it.

cheerio,

mm <*))))><

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C...l_Progressive_Caucus

The rascals you are referring to? I count 61 of them, among 455, which is hardly the October Revolution. Hawkins calibrates Marxism at 130 and the Unites States at 421, so it would seem unlikely that we could drop that far in one or two election
cycles. I'm not really that worried about it.

caritas,

mm <*)))))><

David Horowitz has some absolutely scathing articles concerning Progressivism, including this one.

quote:

The left's inability to understand the most basic economic fact � that people need an incentive to produce � has caused the unnecessary deaths of tens of millions of people � mostly poor � in the last 75 years. But thanks to a politically corrupted media and educational system, their pig-headed pursuit of socialist fantasies goes on.

Brad, that Shalom Place Prognosticators post was a hoot.

(Catching up with my reading. . . . and trying to figure what this thread is about. )

"There is a spectre haunting Europe..."

What the thread is about are all of these political tribes and all the memes coming together in some futuristic, blissed out yellow meme, some glorious over the rainbow utopia where 90% of political discourse is no longer wasted on green
oppressing the oppressors and blue/orange shooting back at them.

Thomas Jefferson was awash in an orange meme sea of discovery, and seemed to anticipate green on the horizon.

Lincoln's heart broke over the Mexican American war and one of the bloodiest turning points in history, yet he believed in the promise of the Founders' vision.

Woodrow Wilson envisioned a League of Nations, perhaps a century or two too soon.

Tielhard de Chardin envisioned the emergence of the noosphere.

Eisenhower warned us about excessive blue/orange
military industrial complexes.


Kennedy sang the praises of the blue meme and patriotism in Profiles in Courage, the most influential book by a sitting senator up to that time. He launched an orange meme revolution with the Apollo program, and a green revolution with the civil rights movement.

Reagan defeated a red/green evil empire with blue patriotism and orange technology.

Al Gore wrote the second most influential book by a sitting senator, Earth in the Balance, from his green meme perspective.

When will the yellow meme kick in, and is there any evidence on the horizon?

Many green Buddhists are disappointed with the Dalai Lama's support for the military action in Afghanistan, and orange meme psychiatrists are shown up by his wisdom. Orange meme Wall street does not appreciate his ideas on sustainability.

I'd nominate the Dalai Lama for something, but he surely has yellower meme and turquoise and transpersonal things to do today!

-------------------------------------------------
An Ann Coulter update:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ann_Coulter

Her ex-room-mate is a liberal watchdog:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cindy_Cohn

Thank heaven for liberal watchdogs, BTW.

Phil Donahue asked her if it were true that she left New York to get away from Jews. Her reply,
"Maybe that will help me with the Muslims."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Fukuyama

He said ideology is over and done with, but it reminds me of the Monty Python sketch "Bring out your dead." Not quite dead yet, but the yellow meme will render it impotent, if transhumanism doesn't di that first and if I am going to be impotent, I surely want to look impotent. I'll have my genetic designer call yours.

fuk_yu_ma@ideology_is_dead_but_not_quite_yet.gov

mellow_yellow.com

MM, I think you're becoming a Spiral Dynamics guru.

All these perspectives do need to have their say, and that's fine, just so long as they don't act out destructively. Ultimately, it is the task of Yellow managers to help sort things out and to enable the development of a higher perspective that affirms the good in all levels and allows them to make their contributions. Unfortunately, neither the U.N. nor the U.S. government seems to have much of a capacity for doing so, although I believe they're both reaching a point where the burdens of Green will necessitate it.

Probably the best example of a Yellow leader is Tony Blair, who can affirm with Bush the need for a pro-active WOT while summoning the nations of the world to do something about poverty.

Phil,

I am a student of spiral dynamics, and I have not quite gotten the hang of it yet.

"The world's greatest living philosopher, in my opinion and that of many others, is Jurgen Habermas." -- Ken Wilber

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jurgen_Habermas

Here he is in all his glory, getting his picture taken with Cardinal Ratzinger. Perhaps we should denounce Pope Benedict as a neo-Marxist. These guys are getting a bit long in the tooth, and we could see the end of Marxist thought in another generation or so, IMO

What does Wilber have to say about Francis Fukuyama?

Francis Fukuyama recently caused an international
sensation with the publication of The End of History, in which he asks "whether, at the end of the twentieth century, it makes sense for us to speak of a coherent and directional History of humankind? The answer I arrive at is yes, for two separate reasons. One has to do with economics, and the other has to do with what is termed the
'struggle for recognition.'"

The 'struggle for recognition' is simply the theme
, developed from Hegel to Taylor, that MUTUAL RECOGNITION---what we have been calling the FREE EXCHANGE of MUTUAL SELF-ESTEEM among all peoples
(the emergence of the rational-egoic self-esteem needs)---is an omega point that pulls history and communication forward toward the free emergence of
of that mutual recognition. SHORT OF THAT EMERGENCE, history is a brutalization of one self or group of selves trying to triumph over, dominate, or subjugate others.

When, on the other hand, human beings universally
recognize each other "as beings with a certain worth or dignity," then HISTORY in that sense "COMES TO AN END because the longing that had driven the historical process---the struggle for recognition---has been satisfied in a society characterized by universal and reciprocal recognition. No other arrangement of human social institutions is better able to satisfy this longing, and hence no further progressive historical change is possible." The End of History.

Echoing Hegel, Fukuyama notes that "this does not mean that the natural cycle of birth, life, and death would end, or that important events would no longer happen, or that newspapers reporting them would would cease to be published. It means, rather, that there would be no further progress in the development of underlying principles and institutions, because all of the really big questions had been settled."

-Sex, Ecology, Spirituality, Page 321

Some corners of this block-headed globe, including corners of my own mind, have not been adequately reached as of yet. PBPGINFWMY!

Please

Be Patient

God Is Not

Finished

With Me

Yet!

Re: Prison-industrial complex

I tend to agree with that. First off, I wouldn�t freak out that self-supporting relationships develop between different groups in a free economy. And the name �prison-industrial complex� is too ripe for demagoguery. Surely anyone with kids knows there is a �Sponge Bob-Nintendo complex�. But I do think there is a sane place between locking them up and throwing away the key and simply letting highly dangerous felons loose because it satisfies some liberal�s squishy sense of compassion.

Surely we run into each extreme when we see criminality as only a moral failure or only the result of a string of causes and thus the involvement of no free choice. But this prison-industrial complex issue isn�t likely to get solved anytime soon if only because the leftist/liberal/progressive ideas on reform have often been so incompetently na�ve that this tends to leave the rest of us simply fighting to keep violent criminals in prison and out of neighborhoods; that is, fighting to at least keep things as they are and not let them get worse. Surely there are a few �law and order� rednecks to blame for the state of our prison system but I lay an awful lot of blame on the whacky liberals who have made anyone rightly a bit gun-shy of reform.

You post so much in some of your posts, MM, that it takes a while to absorb it all. Sooo�

Re: Ann Coulter at Wiki:

Not a very complimentary Wiki entry for her. In the meantime I was over at AnnCoulter.com and noticed that that tribe (the coultercons) now have a forum. I registered. Surprisingly it�s not just fawning praise of Ann. And some of the rules are suprisingly non-Coulteresque:

quote:

5.Using words like "Nazi", "racist," "KKK member," and "fascist," or any of the other nasty things that leftists say about Coulter or conservatives in general, when referring to Ann Coulter or the moderators, administrator, or members of this site. That will result in being automatically removed, so if you're going to include those words in your last post, make it a good one. Of course, the post, all of your other posts, and all memory of your ever having been on this board will be obliterated, so the value of doing that is questionable.

In fact, by even commenting on these rules in this way outside of the forum I may risk being banned:

quote:

4. Sucking up to mods and the admin on this board and then trashing them on every other board on the net. If I hear about a bunch of Herp-stabbing on other forums by posters whom I have let in here in good faith, those posters will cease to exist. I think it's fair enough. Every time you log in here, it costs Ann Coulter money, and the admin and the mods have her faith that they are doing a good job. By costing her money and then using little things you dig up here, or things that I say that offend you (sorry, you have no Constitutional right not to be offended) to run off and trash the place -- well, let's just say I'm not going to put up with it. Find another hobby.

Considering that Ann regularly uses inflammatory language, how un-Coulterish to have an automatic ban for such things as "racist" or "fascist". That kind of "no tolerance" policy seems to mirror what liberals do. They ought to be making fun of such nonsense, not copying it. Oh well.

On the prison-industrial complex, there are already signs that the yellow meme solutions are kicking in.
My state has now registered sex offenders and posted their names and addresses on the internet. There are
also communities being set up specifically for them,
and attempts are being made to discern which are dangerous and which are treatable. Sticky business!

There is also restitution for property crimes, and victim advocacy. Ankle bracelets are used to keep track of parolees.

Coulter wants to bring back flogging. How about a combination of flogging and blogging?

With the extreme politics of whatever stripe you can fill in different names in the blanks and they almost say the same thing. At least it seems that way to me.

More from Wilber on Fukuyama:

"The really big questions" would be settled in this sense: once we have arrived at the worldcentric rational structures that both allow and demand (1)
free and equal subjects of civil law, (2) morally free subjects, and (3) politically free subjects as world citizens (worldcentric agents in worldcentric communions)---once we have arrived at that, what more, specifically, COULD there be to do in THAT domain. In that domain, "the really big questions would have been settled." And I believe that is indeed true.

We would, of course, continue to fine-tune the ways to implement these freedoms, and help insure their global equity. And we might, indeed find NEW
freedoms. But these three factors would surely form an important platform for any new developments. And to the extent that History up to that point has been the clash of factions and refused those three factors, then this would indeed mark The End of History.

All of which, as I said, can be true (and is true, I think)and still leave open---and still demand---
that further HISTORICAL changes are indeed possible, however much they will build upon the platform of mutual egoic self-esteem and self-recognition---and for the simple reason that there are indeed of structures of consciousness BEYOND THE EGOIC,
structures that, in their own turn, exert subtler and stronger omega pulls on the already actualized self-esteem needs. And these new omega pulls will most assuredly DESTABALIZE the apparently "secure" structure of universal egoic recognition (which will be PRESERVED, for sure...
but also painfully NEGATED, in the future paradigm wars set to rock the globe). [Written in 1995]

In other words, there are indeed some more "really big questions" that would still need to be settled
:History would not have ended, only Egoic History.

SES, pp. 321-22

--------------------------------------------------
Which leads into mystic transpersonal wars of the future, I guess. Or maybe something like this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clash_of_Civilizations

He doesn't really go into this, but he has already addressed conflicts on the mythic and egoic level.
Not sure what he means by paradigm wars. I'll have to read yet another Wilber book and the 300+ pages
of notes and graphs in SES

I ran across this story on the Prison Industrial Complex. I can picture the Che Guevara stickers on her Volkswagon microbus. I prescribe 2 hours of Rush
each day for a year, but even a broken clock is right twice a day, and some of what she has to say
reveals the shadow side of corporatism.

http://prisonactivist.org/crisis/evans-goldberg.html

As Fukuyama and Wilber have indicated, we are still working quite a few bugs out of the system...